Estrada Impeachment December 11, 2000 Transcript

December 11, 2000

AT 2:08 P.M., THE HONORABLE CHIEF JUSTICE HILARIO G. DAVIDE, JR., PRESIDING OFFICER, CALLED THE RESUMPTION OF THE IMPEACHMENT TRIAL TO ORDER.

THE SERGEANT-AT-ARMS (MR. LEONARDO LOPEZ). Please all rise for the arrival of the Senator Judges.

I announce the arrival of the Chief Justice, the Honorable Hilario G. Davide, Jr. and the Senate President Aquilino Q. Pimentel, Jr.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER (CHIEF JUSTICE DAVIDE). The impeachment trial of His Excellency, the President of the Philippines, is now resumed.

The Honorable Senator Judge Anna Dominique Coseteng will lead us in prayer for the Court, for everybody, and also for the Senate President, who is celebrating his birthday today.

SEN. COSETENG. Yumuko po tayo at mataimtim na manalangin.

P R A Y E R

O Panginoon sa kaluwalhatian, dinggin Mo ang aming pagsusumamo. Bigyan Mo kami ng malinaw na pagiisip, katatagan ng paninindigan at higit sa lahat, lubusang tapang upang ipatupad ang napakahalagang papel na aming ginagampanan bilang mga hukom sa makasaysayang pag uusig na aming kinakaharap.

Ipagkaloob Mo sa amin, Mahal na Ama, ang mas malalim na kakayahan na aming matahip at matanto ang katotohanan mula sa kasinungalingan. Ipagsanggalang Mo kami mula sa hiyaw, sa ingay at sigaw, batikos o papuri man, na maaaring makasagabal sa aming pagbibigay ng makatarungang hatol sapagkat alam namin na sa bandang huli, ang aming pagtahak sa landas patungo sa katotohanan at katarungan, ay lagi Ka naming kasama at hindi Mo kami pababayaan.

Biyayaan Mo kami ng Inyong mapaghimalang grasya upang sa gayon kami ay manilbihan nang buong tapat sa sambayanan. Ipagkaloob Mo rin sa sambayanan ang kakayahan at linaw ng isip upang maalis ang amor propio at upang tanggapin ang anumang kapasiyahan ng Senado bilang hukuman sa paglilitis na ito.

Aming makapangyarihang Ama, hinihiling po namin sa Inyo na patuloy na gabayan ang kasalukuyang pinuno namin sa Mataas na Kapulungan, sa katauhan ni Ginoong Aquilino Pimentel, Jr., na nagdiriwang ng kanyang kaarawan sa araw na ito.

Purihin Ka Diyos Ama ngayon at magpakailanman.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Thank you.

The Sergeant at Arms will now make the proclamation.

Please be seated.

THE SERGEANT AT ARMS. All persons are commanded to keep silent, on pain of imprisonment, while the Senate is sitting for the trial on the Articles of Impeachment against Joseph Ejercito Estrada, President of the Philippines.

REP. APOSTOL. Same appearance for the prosecution, and may I submit the names of the three private prosecutors who will be allowed to assist the public prosecutors: Private Prosecutor Arno Sanidad, Pablito Sanidad and Edcel Lagman.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Granted.

MR. DAZA. Your Honor, for the defense, same appearances last Friday, December 8.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. May we hear first the Honorable Majority Leader. They have made their appearances already.

THE MAJORITY LEADER. Mr. Chief Justice, it may be in order to have the calling of the roll.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Any motion to dispense with the roll call?

THE MAJORITY LEADER. I so move then, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Any objection? The roll call is dispensed with, anyway this is only a resumption of the trial after a suspension last week.

On the matter of the approval … the reading and approval of the Journal…

THE MAJORITY LEADER. Mr. Chief Justice, I move that we defer consideration of the Journal of December 7 and December 8 as this is still being finalized.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Any objection? There being none, approved as so moved.

We already had the entry of appearance, so we will now continue with the trial proper. The Majority Leader.

THE MAJORITY LEADER. Mr. President, pursuant to the agreement reached earlier this afternoon, I request that counsel on both sides indicate the name of the examining witness — examining counsel and assisting counsel for each witness as we now continue the presentation of witnesses.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The prosecution is requested to do as desired.

REP. APOSTOL The examining counsel on the first witness that we will present this afternoon is Congressman Nib Baterina, assisting counsel will be yours truly.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. And for the record, since advertence was made already to the agreement reached at the conference this afternoon immediately preceding the resumption of the session, the corresponding order of the conference will be submitted later and probably can be taken up tomorrow. So that is it, the witness now — who was the witness last Friday on the stand?

THE MAJORITY LEADER. When we suspended, Mr. Chief Justice, Emma B. Lim was on the witness stand.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Call the witness for the continuation.

Yes, MR. Daza.

MR. DAZA. If Your Honor, please, for this witness now, the examining counsel will be MR. Estelito Mendoza and assisting counsel will be Raul Daza.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The cross-examining counsel?

MR. DAZA. That’s correct, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, noted.

Prosecutor Baterina, you may now continue with the direct testimony of witness Emma Lim.

REP. BATERINA. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Where’s the witness?

REP. BATERINA. May we ask that the witness Emma B. Lim be called to — recalled to the witness stand, Your Honors?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. It is so ordered that a page of the Senate sitting as an Impeachment Court will have to fetch the witness from the witness room if she is there.

[The witness Emma Lim is fetched at the witness room by the Senate Page]

REP. BATERINA. For the record, Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors, when we last suspended the hearing, we were showing to the witness several exhibits which were previously marked by the Court, and I would also want to ask that these exhibits be produced so that we can continue with the trial, Your Honors.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Produce the exhibits and make them all the time available to the prosecution, to the witness and also to the defense.

Where is the witness?

You may take your seat, Ms. Emma Lim. You will be testifying under the same oath.

Prosecutor Baterina may now proceed.

REP. BATERINA. With the permission of the Honorable Court.

Madam Witness, when we suspended the hearing on Friday, you were shown several documents.

I will now re show to you these documents.

Last Friday you were given several documents. Find out these documents that are now being given to you, if you know these documents.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Would you now give the identi¬fication number of the documents by exhibit numbers?

REP. BATERINA. Thank you, Your Honors. The documents that we refer to are Exhibits “H”, “I”, “J”, “L”, “M”, “N”, “O” and “P”, Your Honors. And Exhibit “Q”.

Madam Witness, tell us. Can you recognize these docu¬ments?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Mr. Chief Justice, may I …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, the Senate President.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. … ask one question of Mr. Baterina.You have no Exhibit “K”? Because from your enumera¬tion you said, “H”, “I”, “J” and you went to “L”.

REP. BATERINA. And then “Q”, Mr. President.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. There’s no letter “K”?

MS. LIM. Wala po.

REP. BATERINA. We don’t have a “K” here.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Okay.

REP. BATERINA. May I ask that MR. … Yes, Your Honors, we don’t have Exhibit “K” with us.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. But the prosecution has it. This refers to the specimen signatures of a witness.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Your Honors. We have Exhibit “K”, but as far as this witness is concerned, Exhibit “K” may not have any bearing with her testimony.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What are these exhibits that you have looked into?

MS. LIM. Ito po iyong mga duplicate copies ng deposit slips ng mga tseke na dineposit ko po sa … deposit sa savings account ni Governor Chavit Singson sa Metrobank, Ayala Center Branch, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Why do you know that these are deposit slips deposited in the name of Governor Luis “Chavit” Sing¬son in the Metrobank Branch Ayala?

MS. LIM. Kasi po, ako po ang nagdeposit lahat ng tseke na ito, Your Honor, except Exhibit “M”.

REP. BATERINA. Except Exhibit…?

MS. LIM. “M” po.

REP. BATERINA. “M” as in Manila?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. May I ask you on Exhibit “H” which I would like the counsels for the President to look into because we have a xerox copy of the same to find out whether the xerox copy can be a xerox copy of the original, except for some of the markings.

MR. MENDOZA. We are pleased to stipulate that the xerox copy marked as Exhibit “H” is a faithful reproduction of the Metrobank deposit slip which counsel has shown to which the prosecutor has shown to counsel. We make the observation, however, that the xerox copy is all in black while the original appears to be in different inks. Some in blue ink, some in violet and some in black ballpen.

REP. BATERINA. That is admitted. That is admitted, Your Honor. That is really true.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, but for purposes of a cross examination, you may keep the original of the document ready at all times.

REP. BATERINA. Actually, Mr. Chief Justice, we will be showing something like 8 or 9 documents of this kind and the observation of the Honorable Estelito Mendoza is correct that there are stamps which are in other color than what is now what the xerox copy contains because the xerox copy is in black and white.

MR. MENDOZA. I have a suggestion if Your Honor…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What is that?

MR. MENDOZA. Unless these papers which are being presented are official records of, let us say, a bank, which cannot be left, perhaps it may be more convenient to mark the originals already and if the substitution is desired, the substitution can be made when they are offered in evidence.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Were not the originals marked earlier?

MR. MENDOZA. No, it’s a xerox copy which has been marked, Your Honor. So, we have this problem.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. How do you respond to that suggestion?

REP. BATERINA. We did not request for the marking of the originals, Mr. Chief Justice, because precisely we did not want that the originals be intercalated with the markings. So, we have asked the President’s counsel…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Well, anyway anyway, for purposes of the cross examination, the cross examiner may refer to the original which shall be kept in your custody for as long as these are needed by the defense.

REP. BATERINA. And we will make available the originals to the counsel for the President at any time that they would ask for it, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may now proceed.

REP. BATERINA. Do you know who made these the handwritten entries in Exhibit “H”?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Who made the handwritten entries?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor, ang nagsulat nitong deposit slip na ito, except po iyong nakasulat sa black ballpen, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is an entry under bank initials, PNB Branch, Naga, check number 0016119, an amount,P= 1,155,000. Can you tell the Honorable Court to…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Excuse me. For clarity into the record, she mentioned of an entry which she did not write…

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. …which is in black. Which is that entry? What is that entry?

REP. BATERINA. Will you look at the entry which you said was not your entry but which is in handwriting. And tell the Honorable Court what is that all about, and if you can read it, please read it.

MS. LIM. Ito pong nakasulat sa black ballpen po, ‘yong una, hindi ko po mabasa, pero itong iba: “For late dep. Regional CK 1,155,000 2:15 P.M.,” Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There are entries which can be read or handwritten entries which can be read: “PNB Naga, Check No. 0016119; amount, 1,155,000.” Who made that entry?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What about the signature down under in this particular deposit slip, who made that? Who impressed that particular signature?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What is the signature about?

MS. LIM. Ibig sabihin po, ako po ‘yong nagdeposito ‘yong tseke, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. When did you accomplish the deposit slip?

MS. LIM. N’ong ano po, May 7, 1999 po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. I’ll show you another deposit slip or another document and which has already been pre-marked as Exhibit “I”. Kindly tell us what this document is all about, if you know.

MS. LIM. Ito rin po ang isa sa mga duplicate copies ng deposit slips ng mga tseke na galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto-remittance po niya sa collections po niya ng jueteng kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is an entry under bank initials, PNB Branch Naga, Check No. 0016125; amount, 1,179,000, who made that entry?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What about the signature which appears at the foot of Exhibit “I”, who made that particular signature? Who impressed that particular signature?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. When did you write your signature on that deposit slip?

MS. LIM. Noong ginawa ko po itong deposit slip, Your Honor, June 11, 1999.

REP. BATERINA. A while ago, you were saying that this deposit slip was…. May I withdraw, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Withdrawn.

REP. BATERINA. This entry which has already been shown to you and which you said was the entry of… which was extracted from the check, is that correct?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Whose check was that, if you know?

MS. LIM. Tseke po galing kay Mr. Anton Prieto, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Why do you say that that check came from Anton Prieto?

MS. LIM. Kasi po, siya lang po ang nagbibigay o nag-i-isyu ng PNB Naga check kay Governor Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What is that figure which can be found opposite the word “total deposit”? What is that figure, if you know?

MS. LIM. Ito po ‘yong amount n’ong tseke na dineposit ko, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Can you read that amount for the court?

MS. LIM. One million…. Ito po?

REP. BATERINA. Oo. Yes.

MS. LIM. One million one hundred seventy-nine thousand, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Mr. Chief Justice, I forgot to show it to the counsel for the President. May I show it to them, so that they can find out whether the xerox copy, Your Honors, is a faithful reproduction of the original document.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may do so. The counsel, however, is advised that whenever he would address the Presiding Officer, it should be addressed to the Court.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. We make the same manifestation as the previous exhibit, Your Honor. We so stipulate.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let it be recorded.

REP. BATERINA. Another document which is Exhibit “J”. Tell us, what is Exhibit “J?”

MS. LIM. Ito rin po sa isa sa mga duplicate copies ng mga deposit slips ng mga tseke na galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto para kay Governor Luis ‘Chavit’ Singson, remittance po niya sa…jueteng collections po niya sa Bicol, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is a… May I also show this to the President’s counsel, Your Honor…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may.

REP. BATERINA. …for comparison?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Make a comparison, Mr. Counsel, for the…

MR. MENDOZA. We make the same stipulation as the previous exhibits, Your Honors.

REP. BATERINA. There is a figure, or there are entries which can be read as “Bank initials, PNB Branch, Naga; Check No. 0016124, amount 857,000. ”

Who made that particular written entry?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. From where did you extract these particular entries?

MS. LIM. Doon po sa tseke na diniposit ko, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Can you tell the Honorable Court what check was that?

MS. LIM. Ito po, isa rin sa mga tseke na galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto, remittance po niya sa jueteng collections po niya sa Bicol para kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. How do you know that the check that was deposited, the deposit of which corresponds to what is now contained in Exhibit “J” came from Mr. Anton Prieto?

MS. LIM. Kasi po siya lang po ang nag iisyu kay Governor Singson ng PNB Naga check, Your Honor. At makikita po ninyo iyong check numbers, iyong mga series po ng mga check numbers po, sa mga deposit slip halos magkakasunod, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is a signature at the foot of Exhibit “J”. Who’s signature is that?

MS. LIM. Signature ko po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. I show you another document which is marked as Exhibit “L”.

Kindly tell the Honorable Court if you can identify that particular exhibit?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What is that exhibit?

MS. LIM. Ah, isa rin po sa mga duplicate copies ng mga deposit slips ng mga tseke na galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto, remittance po niya sa jueteng collections niya sa Bicol para kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Again, Your Honors, may I show the original deposit slip or the duplicate original deposit slip and the xerox copy of the same for comparison by the counsel of the President.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The request is granted.

MR. MENDOZA. We are pleased to make the same stipulation as the preceding exhibit, Your Honors.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Noted.

REP. BATERINA. There are entries under the blanks…bank initials, PNB PNB; Branch Naga, Naga; Check No. 0016126, and then 0016127 and then the amounts 674,00, 66,000; ah, 6600.

Do you know who made these particular entries?

MS. LIM. Ako po ang nagsulat nito, Your Honor, pero iyong pagkabasa n’yo po sa “66000,” kulang po ng zero. Puwedeng basahin ko na lang po iyong tama?

REP. BATERINA. Please do that.

MS. LIM. Iyong amount po doon sa Check No. 0016126, 674,000; iyong Check No. 0016127, 660,000, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Who made these entries?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Excuse me. What document is the witness referring to?

REP. BATERINA. The witness is referring to Exhibit “L”, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “L”, okay.

REP. BATERINA. Who made these entries?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is another entry at the foot or at about the down below these two entries that you have just identified. Kindly read into the records what that that amount or that entry so that it can be placed into the records?

MS. LIM. Total deposit, P1,334,000, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What does that mean, if you know?

MS. LIM. Ito po iyong total amount noong dalawang tseke na dineposit ko, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Who made that entry?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Then there is a signature underneath Exhibit “L”, whose signature is that?

MS. LIM. Signature ko po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. I show you another document which is now marked as Exhibit “M” as in Manila. Kindly look at it and find out whether you can recognize the document.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What is that document?

MS. LIM. Isa sa mga duplicate copies ng mga tsekeng galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto, remittance po niya sa jueteng collections po niya sa Bicol para kay Presidente Estrada through Gov. Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. “To” or “through?”

MS. LIM. Through Gov. Singson.

REP. BATERINA. I ask, Mr. Chief Justice, that these documents be looked into by the distinguised members of the defense to find out whether the xerox copy which is placed close to it is a faithful reproduction of the original?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Granted. The defense is requested to make the appropriate observation/manifestation or whatever.

MR. MENDOZA. If Your Honors please, we would like to call attention to the fact that the xerox copy marked Exhibit “M 1″ and “M 2″ do not show quite legibly the amounts appearing in the original. For example, the amount of the check on Exhibit “M 2″ is hardly legible and so is the check number. So, while we may stipulate that the xerox copy marked Exhibit “M 1″ and “M 2″ appears to be that of the original shown by counsel, we would like to manifest that the xerox copies does not show clearly the entries in the original.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Manifestation is recorded.

REP. BATERINA. Thank you, Counsel Mendoza. That’s true, Your Honors, we will admit that but in a short while we will ask our teammates to please have another xerox copy. So, may we defer Mr. Chief Justice the presentation of that document…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The presentation can be done later at a proper time.

REP. BATERINA. To be done later.

I show you another document which is Exhibit “N”. Please look at Exhibit “N” and find out whether you still recognize the document?

MS. LIM. Sandali, ilabas ko po para mas maliwanag.

REP. BATERINA. So, what is this document, Exhibit “N”?

MS. LIM. Isa rin po ito sa duplicate copies ng mga deposit slips noong tseke na galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto, Your Honor, remittance po niya sa jueteng collections para kay President Estrada through Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is an entry which can be read “PNB Naga, then Check No. 0016116, amount 1,925,000. Who made that entry?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What is that entry all about?

MS. LIM. Ito po ‘yong mga informations galing po sa tseke na dineposit ko, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Whose check was that, if you know?

MS. LIM. Tseke po galing kay Mr. Anton Prieto, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There’s a signature underneath or at the foot of Exhibit “N”. Can you tell the Honorable Court whose signature is that?

MS. LIM. Signature ko po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. When did you place your signature in that document?

MS. LIM. Noong ginawa ko po ang deposit slip na ito, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What date?

MS. LIM. October 11, 1999, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Mr. Chief Justice, may I show the document together with the xerox copy of the original?

THE PRESIDING CHIEF. You may.

REP. BATERINA. And may I request the defense to compare the two to find out whether the xerox copy is a faithful reproduction of the original.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Any response from counsel for the defense?

MR. MENDOZA. As requested, we make the separation, Your Honors, and as manifested earlier, the inks which appear in the original, of various colors, which is not shown in the xerox copy.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Observations noted.

REP. BATERINA. Thank you.

I show you another exhibit, Exhibit “O”. And please tell the Honorable Court what Exhibit “O” is all about.

MS. LIM. Isa rin po ito sa mga duplicate copies ng mga deposit slips ng mga tseke na galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto na collections po niya sa jueteng sa Bicol para po kay President Estrada through Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. I again request the lawyer of the President to find out whether the xerox copy is a faithful reproduction of the original.

MR. MENDOZA. We make the same manifestation.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Noted.

REP. BATERINA. Kindly read an entry at the a handwritten entry at about the middle of the page and place that entry as you read it into the records.

MS. LIM. PNB Naga 0016140 1,445,000, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Who wrote this entry?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Do you know from where you got that entry?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Where did you get that entry? Where did you extract that entry?

MS. LIM. Galing po sa tseke na dineposit ko, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is a signature at the foot of Exhibit “O”. Whose signature is that?

MS. LIM. Signature ko po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. When did you impress that signature on that exhibit?

MS. LIM. Noong dineposit ko po ‘yong tseke, Your Honor, no’ng December 7, 1999, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Another exhibit, Exhibit “P”. I am going to show you this exhibit and find out what that exhibit is all about.

MS. LIM. Isa rin po ito sa mga duplicate copies ng mga deposit slips ng mga tseke na galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto. Remittance po niya ito sa jueteng collections po niya sa Bicol para kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. You stated that this is a check that came from Anton Prieto. But whose check was that, if you know?

MS. LIM. Tseke po ni Mr. Anton Prieto, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is a… Can you read the entry at about the middle of the exhibit in the space which is for bank initials, branch, check number and amount? Place that on record, please.

MS. LIM. PNB Naga, 0016142, 1,340,000. Tapos iyong baba po ng 1,340,000, may nakalagay po doon “late dep.”

REP. BATERINA. Who made that entry “late dep.”?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po alam, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What about that entry which can be read as 1,340,000? Who made that entry?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And what is that entry about?

MS. LIM. Ito po iyong amount po ng tsekeng dineposit ko, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. There is a signature at the foot of the document. Whose signature is that?

MS. LIM. Signature ko po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. A penultimate document, Mr. Chief Justice. Exhibit “Q,” I’m presenting to you, what is that exhibit?

MS. LIM. Isa rin po ito sa deposit slips, duplicate copies ng deposit slips ng mga tseke po galing kay Mr. Anton Prieto para sa remittance po niya sa jueteng collections po niya sa Bicol para kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Before we proceed, Mr. Chief Justice, we forgot to ask the counsel of the President to find out if the xerox copies are faithful reproduction of the two original documents. May we ask that…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Meaning Exhibits “P” and “Q”?

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Request granted.

MR. MENDOZA. We make this a manifestation, Your Honors, the same manifestations for each, recorded.

REP. BATERINA. Thank you.

There is an entry about the middle of Exhibit “P.” Can you read that entry into the records?

MS. LIM. Tapos na po ito, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What do you say, counsel for the prosecution?

REP. BATERINA. Yes, thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

What about Exhibit “Q,” can you find out what that entry is at the middle of the exhibit, the handwritten entry in the middle of the exhibit? Can you read that into the records?

MS. LIM. PNB Naga, 0016149, P1,430,000, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Where did you extract that entry?

MS. LIM. Doon po sa tseke na dineposit ko po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Whose check was that?

MS. LIM. Tseke po galing kay Mr. Anton Prieto, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Why do you know that that check came from Mr. Anton Prieto?

MS. LIM. Dahil siya lang po ang nag-i-isyu ng tseke kay Governor Singson ng PNB Naga, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors, Exhibit “M” is not very, very legible, and the xerox copy the best that our panel can do. And according to one of the members of the panel, the best technology can only capture so much. So, I am very sorry to say that we cannot come out with a better facsimile, Your Honor, or a better xerox copy.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Then mark the original.

REP. BATERINA. Yes. Then we will mark the original. We will now mark the original, Your Honors as Exhibit “M.” We ask that the secretary general or his assistant will please mark the exhibit as Exhibit “M”.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. In substitution of what had been marked earlier…

REP. BATERINA. … as in Manila.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. … as Exhibit “M”. In short, you are going to substitute what had been marked earlier as Exhibit “M” with the original copy?

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Mark the original copy as Exhibit “M” and disregard what had been marked earlier as Exhibit “M”, meaning, the machine copy.

REP. BATERINA. But we will now ask whether the witness, Mr. Chief Justice, recognizes this particular exhibit.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What exhibit are you showing to the witness now, the new Exhibit “M”?

REP. BATERINA. The new Exhibit “M”, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Show it to the witness.

REP. BATERINA. We are showing to you the document which has been marked Exhibit “M” just a while ago upon the instructions of the Chief Justice. Find out whether you know that particular document.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What is that document?

MS. LIM. Isa rin po sa duplicate copies ng mga deposit slips ng tseke na galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto na remittance po niya sa jueteng collections po niya sa Bicol para kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. How do you know that that is a deposit slip that came from Anton or that document is a document which bears which is the deposit slip for the check that came from Mr. Anton Prieto.

MS. LIM. Kasi po, ako po ang nagtatago ng mga deposit slips ng mga tseke po ng mga lahat ng deposit slips ni Governor Singson, Your Honor. At saka noong inabot ito sa akin, hindi ko po matandaan kung sino ang nag abot nito sa akin, kung si Governor Singson o isa sa mga staff din po niya. Noong inabot po ito, namarkahan ko po kaagad ng “PNB Naga.” Ibig sabihin po, deposit slip galing po kay Mr. Anton Prieto, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Exhibit “H” to Exhibit “Q”, tell us if you know who is the custodian of these exhibits?

MS. LIM. Ako po mismo, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Where do you keep these documents?

MS. LIM. Sa filing cabinet po namin sa office, Your Honors.

REP. BATERINA. Where is that office of yours?

MS. LIM. Sa Second Floor, LCS Building, San Andres Bukid, Manila, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. But there is a word or two words which can be read as “PNB Naga,” and it’s in red written letters.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What document is counsel referring to?

REP. BATERINA. I we are referring to a …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The new Exhibit “M”?

REP. BATERINA. The new Exhibit “M”, the original exhibit.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Please identify the exhibit.

REP. BATERINA. Yes. The new Exhibit “M”, Your Honors, and which can be read as “PNB Naga”. Kindly tell us who made that writing, that handwriting handwritten words, these handwriting words? Who made that?

MS. LIM. Ako po mismo, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. When did you make that, if you know?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko na po matandaan, Your Honor, pero noong inabot po sa akin ito, itong deposit slip, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. May I ask for just one minute to confer with my co counsel, Your Honor? Just one minute.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The one minute is granted for the prosecution counsels to confer with one another.

THE TRIAL WAS SUSPENDED AT 2:57 P.M.

THE TRIAL WAS RESUMED AT 2:57 P.M.

REP. BATERINA. We are now ready, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Resumed. You may now proceed.

REP. BATERINA. Madam Witness, have you ever been to Malacañang Palace?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Why did you go to Malacañang Palace?

MS. LIM. Kasi inutusan po ako ni Governor Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. When did you go to Malacañang Palace?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko na po matandaan, Your Honor, pero ang natatandaan ko iyong taon 1999, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Why did Governor Singson instruct you to go there?

MS. LIM. Inutusan po niya ako, Your Honor, na samahan ko po iyong driver niya saka isang security niya, saka iyong isang aide po ulit niya na may dadalhin… May dinala po kami doon sa Malacañang, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What was that that you brought to Malacañang Palace?

MS. LIM. Pera po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. How much is this money that you brought to Malacañang Palace?

MS. LIM. Five million cash, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. How did you know of the amount of money that you brought to Malacañang Palace?

MS. LIM. Kasi po umaga po iyon noon. Tinawagan po ako ni Governor Singson sa telepono po sa office, sa LCS office. Ininstrakan po niya ako na dadaanan daw po ako ng driver po niya, saka security po niya saka iyong isang aide niya. Samahan ko daw po sila, pupunta daw po kami sa… Una po ang instructions po niya pupunta kami sa Polk, sa bahay po ni Presidente Estrada sa San Juan, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And why did you go to San Juan, at Polk Street?

MS. LIM. Kasi po iyon po ang utos niya, Your Honor. Iyong driver po niya ininstrakan niya kung saan po kami pumunta.

REP. BATERINA. And what did you do at Polk Street?

MS. LIM. Naghintay po kami ng instruction, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. How did he instruct how did he instruct you to go to Polk Street?

MS. LIM. Bale ano lang po, ang sabi lang po niya sa akin daanan ako ng driver niya, isang security niya saka isang aide niya. Samahan ko daw po sila doon sa bahay po ni Presidente doon sa Polk, sa San Juan para may dadalhin daw po kaming pera.

REP. BATERINA. And what happened after that?

MS. LIM. Noong dumating po iyong driver niya, iyong tatlo po doon sa office, iyon, sumama na po ako sa kanila. Pero noong nasa loob ulit kami ng sasakyan, tumawag po ulit through sa driver po niya, kinausap ulit niya ako. I double check ko daw po kung totoong five million iyong nilagay ng driver niya saka mga security niya, kung totoong five million iyong nakalagay doon sa bag, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. You said that he instructed the driver, how did he instruct the driver? By what means, if you know?

MS. LIM. Sa telepono po, Your Honor, Cell phone.

REP. BATERINA. And when he instructed you to countercheck the amount, what did you do?

MS. LIM. Dinobol check ko po, Your Honor, iyong… bundle count, kaharap po iyong… kasama ko po iyong driver niya, iyong security at saka iyong aide po niya, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Where did you count, bundle count the money?

MS. LIM. Sa loob po ng sasakyan, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What denominations were this money that you counted inside the sasakyan where you were riding on?

MS. LIM. One thousand peso-bills po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And what was the result of your bundle count?

MS. LIM. Okay naman po, tama naman po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. When you said “Okay, tama naman,” what did you mean?

MS. LIM. Tama po iyong sinabi ni Governor Singson na amount na nakalagay sa bag, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What was the amount that Governor Singson told you as the amount that was in the bag?

MS. LIM. Five million po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And when you went to Polk Street and then there was another call, what was that call all about if you know?

MR. MENDOZA. Your Honors please. I just like to manifest that at no time has the witness ever mentioned Polk Street. It is counsel who keeps on repeating Polk Street. All that the witness said is San Juan.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Is it an objection or merely a manifestation?

MR. MENDOZA. Just so that we would not be said to be objecting, Your Honor, I just want to make that manifestation, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. I’ll reform, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Reform.

REP. BATERINA. But if the President’s counsel will only go to the records, I think the witness specifically said that they went first to Polk.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. There will be no need for that. You agreed to reform.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Your Honor.

Where did you count? At what place in Metro Manila? Where was that ride that you were on then when you counted the money that was five million that you were about to bring to Malacañang?

MS. LIM. Noong nandoon pa po kami sa tapat ng building sa LCS Building, Your Honor, binilang ko na po doon bago kami umalis.

REP. BATERINA. And let’s now to make your testimony clearer, when you were in front of LCS Building, wherewere you going?

MS. LIM. Iyong sabi po noong driver, punta daw po kami muna doon sa Polk kasi doon daw po namin imi meet si Malou.

REP. BATERINA. Sa? Where?

MS. LIM. Sa Polk Street sa San Juan. Doon sa bahay po ni Presidente sa Polk.

REP. BATERINA. And what did you do upon that instruction by Governor Chavit Singson?

MS. LIM. Bale sumama lang po ako, kasi bale iyong driver naman na po ang nakakaalam iyong pagpunta doon. Hindi naman po ako marunong, kaya sumasama lang po ako sa kanila, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Were you able to go to Polk Street?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And what did you do at Polk Street?

MS. LIM. Iyon po, bumaba po iyong isang security po ni Gov. saka iyong aide po niya. Sila po ang nakipag usap sa guwardya po doon, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And what happened after that?

MS. LIM. Bumalik ulit sa sasakyan po iyong security saka aide. Sabi po nila wala daw si Malou doon, “maghintay muna tayo ng instruction kay Gov.” Bale sila po ang nakikipag communicate na noon kay Gov, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Then what happened? Can you tell the Honorable Court?

MS. LIM. Naghintay po kami, Your Honor, doon sa labas, nag park po iyong sasakyan doon, nandoon po lahat kami sa loob ng sasakyan, pero iyong isang aide po ni Governor Singson, kasi lunch time na po noon, nagugutom na, pumunta po doon sa loob ng bahay po nina Presidente, nakikain po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Where is that “bahay ni Presidente, nakikain”, where is that bahay?

MS. LIM. Doon sa bahay po niya sa Polk, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Polk? What Polk is that?

MS. LIM. Sa Polk Street.

REP. BATERINA. Spell “Polk”?

MS. LIM. F O L K (laughter).

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Silence!

REP. BATERINA. And what happened after the driver went to eat inside the house of the President at Polk Street?

MS. LIM. Iyon po, nakikain daw. Sabi po niya noong lumabas na po siya, nagtitinga na po siya, sabi niya, “O, ayaw ninyo kasing kumain,” sabi niyang ganoon. “Nakakain na ako. Bahala kayo sa buhay ninyo!” Tapos, tinanong ko po, “Ano’ng ulam ninyo?” Sabi niya, “chicken curry.”

REP. BATERINA. So what happened after the driver went to eat and came out and then what happened after that?

MS. LIM. Iyon po, naghintay pa rin po kami kasi wala pa pong instruction ni Governor Singson.

REP. BATERINA. Then, what happened?

MS. LIM. Noong ano po, nagugutom na rin po kaming tatlo iyong driver, iyong security saka ako kasi tanghali na po iyon, kumain po kami sandali sa isang restaurant po sa may Greenhills, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And after eating, what happened?

MS. LIM. Noong kumakain na po kami, tumawag po ulit si Governor Singson sa driver po niya, Your Honor, sabi niya “Punta na daw tayo sa Malacañang.” Iyon, sumama ulit po ako sa kanila kasi siya naman po ang ininstrakan ni Governor Singson, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Then what happened after Governor Singson instructed the driver that you proceed to Malacañang?

MS. LIM. Iyon po, dinala po nila ako sa Malacañang, pumasok po kami. Hindi ko po alam ang pasikot sikot po sa loob ng Malacañang, Your Honor. Sila ang naghatid sa akin, tapos sabi po nila hanggang dito na mayroon kami ‘yong place na sabi nila hanggang doon lang daw ho puwede ‘yong sasakyan kaya maglakad na daw ako papasok, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And what about that money that you counted bundle counted inside the car where you were riding?

MS. LIM. Binitbit ko po, Your Honor, na naglakad papunta sa bahay na office.

REP. BATERINA. What was the amount that you counted, where was it placed or what was it placed on?

MS. LIM. Sa ano po sa isang black bag na parang attache case pero malapad po siya na attache case lagi pong, ano po ‘yon, binibitbit ni Governor Singson saka ‘yong mga ano niya, kasamahan po niya pag umaalis.

REP. BATERINA. And were you able to get inside that office/residence that you spoke of a while ago?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor. Pero bago ako bumaba sinabihan po ako noong aide saka ‘yong security ni Gob. na pag pinabuksan nila sa iyo, huwag mong bubuksan, sabi po nila sa akin, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Then what happened?

MS. LIM. Iyon, noong ano naman po, noong may dinaanan po ako ‘yong guwardiya, sinabi ko po na, ‘yon pupuntahan ko si Malou ‘yong secretary ni Presidente. Iyon pinapasok naman po ako, Your Honor, hindi naman sila mahigpit.

REP. BATERINA. And what happened after they allowed you to enter that particular office/residence inside Malacañang?

MS. LIM. Ano po ulit, Your Honor, pag pagpasok ulit po doon ‘yong sa mismong tapat na po ‘yong bahay, mayroon po ulit security doon, iyon sinabi ko na naman po na hinanap ko ulit si Malou, pinapasok naman po nila ako.

REP. BATERINA. And what transpired after you entered that office/residence?

MS. LIM. Iyon po, pinapasok po nila ako, dala dala ko po ‘yong bag pero pagpasok ko po doon, nakita ko po si Presidente may kausap po siya pero sinalubong din po ako ni Malou, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. And what happened to the bag that you were carrying?

MS. LIM. Ano po iniwan ko po kay Malou, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. How did you leave it how did you leave the bag to Malou, will you tell us in detail how you left the bag to Malou?

MS. LIM. Basta inabot ko po, kinuha naman po niya tapos nilagay po niya doon sa gilid ng isang office table, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Then what happened?

MS. LIM. Iyon po kinausap din po niya si Governor Singson sa telepono, Your Honor, nag Ilocano po siya.

REP. BATERINA. What did she say in Ilocano?

MS. LIM. Noong ano noong pagkatapos na po siyang nakipag usap kay Governor Singson iyon po ‘yong sabi niya sa akin, “Ayan na ni boss mo?” iyon sabi po niya.

REP. BATERINA. Translated in Ilocano, if the Chief Justice will allow an Ilocano lawyer to translate it to Chief Justice, “where is your boss?” “ayan na ni boss mo?”

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Does the defense agree with the translation?

REP. BATERINA. Well, the President of the Senate who is a half Ilocano and the Senator from Cagayan, Mr. Chief Justice can also interpret. “Ayan na ni boss mo?”

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let it be written in Ilocano.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, thank you.

SEN. ENRILE. Ana kunana?

MS. LIM. “Ayan na ni boss mo?”, kunana, sir.

SEN. ENRILE. “Nasaan si boss mo?”

REP. BATERINA. Oo, “Nasaan si boss mo?, where is your boss?”

Thank you, Senator-Judge Enrile.

And what happened after that?

MS. LIM. Iyon po noong nakuha na po niya ‘yong bag, okay naman po, umalis na po ako, Your Honor, nagpaalam na po ako.

REP. BATERINA. You said that the President was there, you saw the President coming when you went into that building, how far was the President from you at that time?

MS. LIM. Malapit lang po, Your Honor, may kausap.

REP. BATERINA. How far from your place? Can you probably look around and tell us pointing to a particular object or to a particular chair so that the the Honorable Judges can estimate the distance?

MS. LIM. ‘Yon po, ‘yong pagpasok ko po ‘yong after noong ‘yong sa guard, siguro po diyan sa kay Senator Sotto. Pero hindi po ako sigurado na eksaktong eksakto po. ‘Yon lang po ang ma estimate ko po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Did you see the President…? Did you see the President that far?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. What about the President, do you know whether he saw you?

MS. LIM. Nakita po niya ako, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. After that, what did you do? After you went out, what did you do?

MS. LIM. ‘Yon po, sumakay po ulit ako. Tumakbo po akong sumakay doon sa sasakyan po ni Governor Singson, ‘yong naghihintay po sa akin doon po sa ano, sa labas, kasi takot na takot po ako noon.

REP. BATERINA. Why were you afraid, “takot na takot ako noon”?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, with the permission of Honorable Baterina, the Chair recognizes Madam Senator Judge Miriam Defensor Santiago.

SEN. DEFENSOR DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Mr. Chief Justice, can we please have a stipulation between the counsel on the physical distance from the witness to where she earlier pointed?

REP. BATERINA. I don’t get the Lady Senator….

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Well taken. It is not made of record what really is the distance which…that distance pointed to by the witness.

REP. BATERINA. Well taken. We accept that.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yeah, but…

REP. BATERINA. We propose five meters or six meters?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You propose it to the defense.

REP. BATERINA. What is the…? We propose that it’s about five to six meters.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What does the defense say? The distance between the witness and the Honorable Senator Judge Tito Sotto, claimed to be the distance between the witness and the President at the time that she saw him.

MR. MENDOZA. Perhaps we need not speculate on this. Actual measurement can be made, and whatever the measurement is can be made of record.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes. Why don’t you get a tape measure?

REP. BATERINA. May we ask the Secretary General to instruct his people?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let’s do that later. You may proceed now on some other points and make of record that distance after an actual measurement.

REP. BATERINA. May I ask that we call a break, Mr. Chief Justice?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. For what purpose?

REP. BATERINA. Because we will now want to confer with our other panelists.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Other what?

REP. BATERINA. The members of the 11th the panel of 11, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The agreement during the conference this afternoon….

REP. BATERINA. Only for a short while, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. How long is the short while?

REP. BATERINA. One minute, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Suspension of one minute is granted.

THE HEARING WAS SUSPENDED AT 3:16 P.M.

THE HEARING WAS RESUMED AT 3:17 P.M.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Honorable Baterina.

REP. BATERINA. We are ready.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Session is resumed.

REP. BATERINA. Mr. Chief Justice, may I make an oral motion subject probably to a motion that we will file formally, but I will try to articulate the motion so that the Members of the Senate, the Judges, the Honorable Judges can probably find out if this motion is all right.

I move, Mr. Chief Justice, that we make an ocular inspection with this witness inside Malacañang where she gave the money and there to point out the distances that where probably that happened, the occurrence of the taking of that five million, the delivery of the five million in Malacañang.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Since you have premised the motion to be preliminary without prejudice to the filing of a formal motion, the Chair would like to inquire whether you will prepare and file the formal motion.

REP. BATERINA. We intend to file also a formal motion, but to make it right here and now, I would want to put it on record that we are filing a motion to that effect, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The intention is recorded. The Court will await for the formal motion.

REP. BATERINA. And we will also file a formal motion for the production of certain documents at the PNB, Naga, on the matters that had been testified to by the witness, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Why don’t you do that…

REP. BATERINA. In writing.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. …in appropriate pleading.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Your Honor. We are just putting it…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. There is no need to announce the intention to do that because you can do it at anytime.

REP. BATERINA. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Proceed. Are you through with the direct examination?

REP. BATERINA. That will be all for the witness, Your Honors.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Thank you. Cross examination, MR. Mendoza.

MR. MENDOZA. We will now cross examine, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may now proceed.

MR. MENDOZA. Yeah. May I just put on a more convenient microphone, Your Honors.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What kind of microphone is that? Lapel…

MR. MENDOZA. Mobile, Your Honor. But I assure it reproduces accurately.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Can be recorded? Granted.

MR. MENDOZA. Emma Lim. Pipilitin ko pong mas magaan ang tanong ko kesa sa prosecution, siguro para hindi kayo mahirapan magsagot.Eh Congressman Baterina eh kababayan ninyo po?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Taga- Ilocos Sur kayo?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ang sinabi po ninyong address eh Ilocos Sur eh. Doon ho ba kayo naninirahan?

MS. LIM. Doon po ang permanent address ko pero nakatira rin po ako dito sa Manila, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Maaari po ba ninyong sabihin kung saan kayo nakatira rito sa Metro Manila?

MS. LIM. At present po, nakatira ako sa Unit 18 G, Tower B, Kingswood Twin Tower, Vito Cruz Extension, Corner Pasong Tamo, Makati City, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong Unit po 18 D, ano po?

MS. LIM. Eighteen Golf.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah eighteen…

MS. LIM. G as in Golf, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. G as in Golf, Oo. Eh, iyan po ba eh ari ho ba n’yo iyan o inuupahan ninyo?

MS. LIM. Bale hinuhulugan po namin, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hinuhulugan n’yo. Ilang taon na ninyong hinuhulugan?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan pero 5 years to pay po iyon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, maalala kaya ninyo kung magkano na ang naihulog ninyo diyan?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po maano ‘yung exact amount, exact po, pero nag umpisa po kami 1999 po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Nineteen ninety nine lang.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, di isang taon pa lang?

MS. LIM. More than one year, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yun hong maybahay ninyo, saan po nagtratrabaho kung mayroong pinapasukan?

REP. BATERINA. Maybahay? We object, Your Honor, misleading. The maybahay is the wife, the housewife, not… misleading, very misleading, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sorry. I’ll probably not…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Reform, reform the question.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi ho ba kayo ay may asawa?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ang ibig ko… Maybahay ang ibig sabihin niyon ‘yung asawa, eh. Kanya ‘yun pong asawa ninyo saan po ba namamasukan kung nagtratrabaho sa kung namamasukan sa iba?

MS. LIM. Self employed po siya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano po ang kanyang propesyon?

MS. LIM. Isa po siyang dentist at saka businessman, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroon po siyang clinic?

MS. LIM. Dati mayroon siyang sariling clinic, Your Honor, pero binaha.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero?

MS. LIM. Pero binaha.

MR. MENDOZA. Binaha.

MS. LIM. Pero ngayon nakiki clinic na lang siya.

MR. MENDOZA. Saan po ‘yung clinic niya?

MS. LIM. ‘Yung dati po o ‘yung ngayon?

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yun pong ngayon.

MS. LIM. Ah, dito po sa Chinatown, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, sa Chinatown. Kayo po eh napanganak sa Ilocos Sur?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oho. At si Governor Singson matagal na po n’yong kilala ano po?

MS. LIM. Nakilala ko lang po nu’ng ano po, nu’ng kakandidato na po siyang congressman, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano pong taon iyon?

MS. LIM. 1987, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. 1987. Medyo matagal tagal na po ano po?

MS. LIM. Yes.

MR. MENDOZA. Nakatapos na po kayo ng pag aaral nu’ng nakilala n’yo nu’ng 1987.

MS. LIM. Graduating na po ako noon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi po ba nakatulong si Governor Singson sa inyo sa pagpapaaral sa inyo?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi po kayo scholar niya?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, mula pa po kailan kayo nakapagtrabaho kay Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Noong July 1987 po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, nagtrabaho na kayo sa kanya?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sa provincial government ng Ilocos Sur o sabi n’yo congressman? Siguro sa House of Representatives ano po?

MS. LIM. Congressman po siya noon pero hindi po ako sa House of Representatives laging nagre report, dito po sa office niya dito sa San Andres, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi, nu’ng 1987, saan kayo nagtrabaho?

MS. LIM. Dito nga po sa Manila, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At dito na rin ba kayo sa building na ito?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano ngang building iyon?

MS. LIM. LCS building, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. LCS building. Samakatuwid, mula noong 1987 hanggang sa ngayon doon kayo namamasukan sa LCS building.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi ba kayo rin eh hindi ba roon sa LCS building mayroong mga condominium na tinitirhan, parang residence?

MS. LIM. Ano lang po mga kuwarto kuwarto lang po iyon, Your Honor, hindi siya condominium type.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi kayo tumira roon kailanman?

MS. LIM. Tumira po ako doon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O, kailan kayo tumira sa LCS building?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko na po matandaan basta nu’ng na renovate na po ‘yung building, iyon, tumira na po ako doon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kasi sa deklarasyon n’yo marami kayong mga petsang natatandaan hanggang petsa sa araw kanya siguro maaari naman n’yong sabihin kung anong taon kayo tumira sa LCS building.

MS. LIM. Kung hindi po ako nagkamali 1989, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, maski na sa taon hindi n’yo masisiguro kanya sinasabi n’yong kung hindi kayo magkakamali.

MS. LIM. Kasi mahirap hong mag ano ‘yung eksaktong date, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, sa inyong palagay mahirap matandaan ‘yung eksaktong petsa ano po?

MS. LIM. ‘Yung eksaktong petsa na paglipat ko po, Your Honor, kasi hindi naman po ako kaagad tumira doon.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero ngayong araw na ito ano kayang petsa ngayon?

MS. LIM. December 11, 2000 po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero ‘yung pagkakatira n’yo, kayo eh hindi pa rin sigurado sa taon ano po? Lalo siguro n’yong hindi masasabi kung anong buwan ano po?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Noong kayo ay tumira doon, may asawa na ba kayo?

MS. LIM. Wala pa po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kailan ba kayo nag-asawa?

MS. LIM. Nu’ng ano po January 18, 1996, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. So, mula ba sa nu’ng 1987 ba iyon hanggang 1996, tumira kayo doon sa LCS Building?

MS. LIM. Hindi po 1987, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hanggang anong taon?

MS. LIM. Hindi po ako tumira sa LCS Building ng 1987, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kailan kayo tumira roon o natutulog doon sa LCS Building?

MS. LIM. Mga 1989 po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, ’89. Hanggang ano pong taon kayo tumira o natutulog doon sa LCS Building?

MS. LIM. Hanggang 1996 po, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. May we know the materiality of this series of questions, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. The building is owned by Governor Singson. We are developing the attachment of the witness to the Governor.

REP. BATERINA. But this has been going on for some time and then…

MR. MENDOZA. We’ll, we are seeking to emphasize that important fact.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What is the specific objection, Mr. Counsel?

REP. BATERINA. We object on the ground that it’s immaterial, irrelevant and impertinent, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Objection, overruled. The witness may answer.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, kayo ba’y nagbabayad ng upa nuong kayo ay tumitira roon sa building?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi. Hindi ba iyong building na iyon ari ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Maliban sa inyong sarili, mayroon pa ba sa inyong pamilya na nakapagtrabaho kay Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Mayroon din po noon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sinu-sino sa pamilya n’yo ang nagtrabaho kay Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Iyong sumunod sa akin na kapatid ko, naging driver lang po. Iyong parang extra-extra na driver lang po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Anong taon naman siya nagtrabaho?

MS. LIM. Nu’ng ano po — mga ano na rin na po — mga 1990s, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. 19…?

MS. LIM. ‘90s. Nag-umpisa 19…

MR. MENDOZA. 1990s. Anong ibig mong sabihin? Mga 1990, 1991, ’92, ’93, ’94, gano’n ba?

MS. LIM. Basta mga gano’n po, basta 1990 hanggang 1991 ang matandaan ko po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid hindi n’yo matiyak iyong taon ano po?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan iyong eksaktong ano po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Siguro hindi rin n’yo lalong matitiyak kung anong buwan ano po?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At lalung-lalo na kung anong araw ano po?

MS. LIM. Siyempre naman po.

MR. MENDOZA. Okay. Ngayon, maliban sa inyong sarili at sa inyong kapatid, mayroon pa bang iba sa pamilya n’yong nakapagtrabaho kay Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Wala na po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. No’ng pong una kayong magtrabaho kay Governor Singson, magkano po ang sahod ninyo buwan-buwan?

MS. LIM. No’ng nag-start po ako sa kanya – P1,200 per month, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon naman po, magkano po ang sahod ninyo?

MS. LIM. Ngayong present po, 20,000 per month, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Twenty thousand. May bonus pa kung Pasko?

MS. LIM. 13th month pay po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Wala nang Christmas bonus?

MS. LIM. Minsan po, limang libo, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Okay. Kanina po eh palagi n’yong paulit-ulit — hindi ko na mabilang kung ilang beses n’yo sinabi — kung kayo’y kumukuha ng pera, palagi n’yong sinasabing “Para kay Presidente Estra…” “Galing ho ito sa jueteng, para kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Singson.” Hindi po ba?

MS. LIM. Opo, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At iyon po tuwing kukuha kayo ng pera, iyon po ay nababanggit ninyo ano po?

MS. LIM. Hindi po ako kumukuha, tumatanggap po ako ng deliveries po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O, tumatanggap ng pera. Iyon po ay nababanggit n’yo, ano po?

MS. LIM. Hindi po. Kung tatanggapin ko po iyong tseke po, Your Honor?

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi. Teka muna. No’ng inutusan kayo ni Governor Singson, ang aking pagkakarinig — sabihin n’yo naman kung hindi tama, ano po — eh inutusan kayo no’ng unang-unang beses, sabi sa inyo, “Kumuha ka ng pera kung kanino, iyong perang galing sa jueteng para kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Singson.” Hindi ba ganoon ang sinabi ni Governor Singson sa inyo?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O pakiulit nga ninyo kung ano ang bilin sa inyo ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Pag-inuutusan niya po ako, Your Honor, sinasabihan po niya ako, kagaya po kay Mayor Jinggoy ang sabi po niya, “Tawagan muna iyong opisina ni Mayor Jinggoy, tanungin mo kung puwede ka nang pumunta para kunin mo na iyong kuwan doon.”

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong ano?

MS. LIM. “Pick-up-in mo na iyong dapat pick-up-in doon,” sabi po niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, sa aking natatandaan, ako’y nakikinig naman nang mabuti, ilang beses ninyong sinabi na ‘yong kinukuha o kinukuha o tinatanggap na pera galing sa jueteng para kay Presidente Estrada through Governor Singson.

Saan po nanggaling ‘yong pananalita ninyong ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Kasi po, sometime in 1999, sinabihan na po ako ni Governor Singson na pagka ganoong may tinatanggap kami at saka kung kuwan, huwag ho kaming maingay.

“Huwag kayong maingay kasi ‘yan, mga perang ‘yan, galing sa jueteng para kay Presidente,” sabi po niya, Your Honor. Kaya, ‘yon, na noong sinabi niya ‘yong ganoon, nagkakaintindihan na po kami.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Tay ka muna, linawin lang natin, ano. Sinabi ni Governor Singson sa iyo … o sa inyo, sabi mo eh. Kanino? Sa iyo at kanino pa?

MS. LIM. ‘Yong kasamahan ko po sa office, si Mrs. Menchu Itchon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kayong dalawa?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Ngayon, ang sinabi ni Governor Singson sa inyo, huwag kayong maingay. ‘Yong perang tatanggapin ninyo galing sa jueteng para kay Presidente Estrada, ganoon ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sinabi ni Governor Singson ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Nasaan kayo noong sinabi niya ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Nandoon po kami sa LCS office, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Saan sa LCS office niya sinabi ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Sa second floor LCS …

MR. MENDOZA. Kaninong opisina ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Opisina po ni Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Bakit naman nagkaroon ng pagkakataon na sinabi pa niya sa inyo na ‘yong tatanggapin ninyong pera, ‘yan galing sa jueteng para kay Presidente Estrada? Ano’ng pagkakataon ‘yon at nasabi niya ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Kasi po, ‘yong mga time na ‘yon, nagtataka na po kami bakit ang daming dumarating na pera, eh dati rati naman po wala naman pong ganoong perang dumarating sa office, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, sige. Ngayon, ano’ng petsa ‘yon, ano’ng buwan, 1999?

MS. LIM. Sometime early 1999 po, Your Honor, mga January o Feb … Basta ganoon, January hanggang basta nag umpisa ng January hanggang February po, Your Honor, 1999.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Tay ka muna, mukhang itong pananalitang ito eh masyadong mahalaga eh. Kasi, sa totoo, sa deklarasyon ninyo, hindi ko na mabilang kung ilang beses ninyo inulit ‘yon eh, kanya alalahanin ninyong mabuti.

Kailan ba sinabi ni Governor Singson ‘yang mga pangungusap na ‘yan? Kailan niya binigkas ‘yan sa inyo?

REP. BATERINA. Objection, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sabi mo, early 1999.

REP. BATERINA. Objection, Your Honor, already answered.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What was the answer of the witness if it had been answered?

REP. BATERINA. Yes, she said, “January.”

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, January, February. I’m going to ask her only to try to think little more carefully if she can remember the month.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The witness may answer.

MS. LIM. Kasi po noong January 1999, Your Honor, wala pa po noon si Mrs. Itchon, Menchu Itchon, sa office. Bale ako pa rin ako pa lang po ang tumatanggap. ‘Yon, sinabihan na po ako ni Governor Singson noon na ingatan ko po ‘yong mga tinatanggap kong pera kasi galing po sa jueteng.

Tapos, noong dumating na naman po si Mrs. Itchon noong February, kasi nag report po si Mrs. Itchon mga February basta February 1999, hindi ko na po matandaan ‘yong exact date, ‘yon, sinabihan na naman po kaming dalawa, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Tay ka. Noong unang unang sinabihan kayo, di mo natatandaan talaga kung Enero 1999?

MS. LIM. Ako lang po ang sinabihan niya ng January 1999, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh kasi kanina, sinabi mo, noong unang unang sinabihan kayo ni Governor Singson, kayong dalawa ni Mrs. Itchon magkasabay. Di ba sinabi mo kanina?

MS. LIM. Ako ang una pong sinabihan po niya ng …

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. So, ngayon binabago mo ‘yon? Ang ibig mong sabihin, noong unang sabihan ka, ikaw lamang mag isa?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, ano’ng buwan noong 1999 sinabihan kang mag isa?

MS. LIM. January 1999 po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. January 1999. Di mo matatandaan siyempre kung ano’ng petsa, ‘no?

MS. LIM. Opo, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, noong sabihan naman kayong dalawa ni Mrs. Itchon, ano namang buwan?

MS. LIM. February na po iyon, Your Honor. February 1999, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Noong sabihan ka noong January 1999, mayroon ka na bang tinanggap na pera dito sa mga taong binanggit mo?

MS. LIM. Wala pa po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Wala pa. Samakatuwid wala ka pang pagka alam noon na mayroong perang tinatanggap, na malalaking pera, wala pa noon?

MS. LIM. Mayroon na po akong tinatanggap noon, Your Honor, deliveries.

MR. MENDOZA. January 1999?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero wala ka pang kinuha o tinanggap doon sa mga taong binanggit mo ang pangalan kanina?

MS. LIM. Wala pa po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh sino naman ang nagbigay sa iyo ng pera?

MS. LIM. Iyong ano po, iyong nagdeliber po sa office, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ewan ko. Noong tinanggap mo bago January 1999?

MS. LIM. Ang nagdedeliber po noon iyong kapatid ni Governor Singson na si …

MR. MENDOZA. Ah. Teka. Bago January 1999 mayroong kang tinanggap na sa iyong akala galing sa jueteng?

MS. LIM. Wala po akong akala noong bago 1999.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero mayroon kang tinanggap maraming pera bago January 1999?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At sinabi mo galing sa kapatid ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano iyong pangalan nu’ng kapatid niya?

MS. LIM. Bonito Singson po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Bonito Singson. Nagdadala siya ng pera sa LCS Building?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sa iyo ba ibinibigay iyong pera?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ilang beses iyon? Marami bang beses?

MS. LIM. Hindi naman po, kasi every 15 at saka 30. Basta ganoon po. Middle of the month or end of the month po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Nagdadala si Bonito Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Siguro hindi naman sinasabi sa inyo kung kanino galing ano po?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyon po ba cash?

MS. LIM. Cash po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Binibilang ho ba ninyo?

MS. LIM. Bundle count lang po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Palagi mong sinasabi iyong bundle count. Isa bang bundle ilan ang isang bundle?

MS. LIM. Kasi po pagka ganoon bina bundle na po nila iyong binabalot na po nila iyong plastic, iyong clear po na plastic. Tapos mayroon na po siyang naka bundle doon, nakasulat na po 1M.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero ang aking nakikita sa bangko, karanasan kung naka bundle ang mga bills ano, 100 pieces iyon per bundle, hindi ba. Palagay natin, tig i isang daang piso, naka bundle isandaang piraso ng isandaang piso; 1,000 bale isandaang piraso naka bundle. Hindi ba ganoon ang pagkaka bundle?

MS. LIM. Iyong dini deliber po nila sa office na bundle na po sa milyon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah itong sinasabi mo sa deklarasyon mo kanina bundle count, iba ang pagkaka… Ang ibig mong sabihin sa bundle?

MS. LIM. Puwede rin po iyong bundle count na sinasabi ninyo pero kami po kasi kung ganoon na naka bundle na po iyong in millions, ganoon na lang po ang bilang namin.

MR. MENDOZA. Naka bundle ba iyan ng papel o goma?

MS. LIM. Ano po muna, iyong goma muna. Tapos iyon na po na bundle na po siya nung white paper, may sulat na po doon na 1M, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Medyo mahirap maintindihan iyan, ah. Pero balikan uli natin iyong pagde deliber. Mula noong anong taon nagde deliber si Bonito Singson ng pera doon sa LCS Building na kadalasan o na hindi lang hindi tseke pero cash?

MS. LIM. Bale hindi naman po lagi si Mr. Bonito Singson ang nagde deliber, Your Honor, iyong mga messengers din po niya.

MR. MENDOZA. Ha?

MS. LIM. Mga messengers po niya.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, messengers niya. Samakatuwid hindi si Governor Singson ang nagdadalang personal. Paminsan minsan mga utos ni Governor Singson o messengers niya ang nagdadala ano?

MS. LIM. Hindi po si Governor Singson po ang …

MR. MENDOZA. I’m sorry, nagkamali ako.

Pagpaumanhin mo. Ang kapatid ni Governor Singson, si Bonito Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oh, ayon. Iyan ba ay mula noong 1998 nagdedeliber na siya?

MS. LIM. Ang matandaan ko lang po nag umpisa siyang magdeliber noong December 1998, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. 1998. At iyan naman tuloy tuloy hanggang 1999?

MS. LIM. Hanggang 2000, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hanggang 2000, iyong kapatid ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Hindi po lagi ‘yung kapatid niya, ‘yung mga messengers, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mga messengers ng kapatid niya?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At ‘yun namang natatanggap mong ‘yun, dinideposito mo rin sa account ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Depende po sa instruction ni Governor Singson, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kung minsan eh, ang instruction niya “i-deposito mo sa account ko”, ganoon ba?

MS. LIM. ‘Yung iba lang po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pakisabi mo nga kung papaano ang utos ni Governor Singson kung gusto niyang ipa-deposito ‘yung perang natatanggap sa account. Paki-ulit mo lang hangga’t maalala mo ‘yung mga pangungusap na ginagamit niya, pagbigay sa iyo ng utos na mag-deposito ng pera.

MS. LIM. Minsan po pagka ganoon, kung may na-deliver na, “O i-deposit mo na lang sa account ko”. Pero kung minsan po hindi ko sinusunod kasi natatakot po naman akong magdeposit na ako lang, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Okay. Pero lahat na perang natatanggap mo dinideposito mo sa account ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Hindi po lahat, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, kaninong account mo dini-deposito?

MS. LIM. Binibigay ko po kay Governor Singson na cash, Your Honor. Tini-turn over ko po sa kanya.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid mayroong pinadi-deposito sa iyo at mayroon namang ini-intrega mo siya? Ini-intrega mo sa kanyang cash, ganoon ba?

MS. LIM. May mga instances po na ‘yung natatanggap ko na deliveries kinukuha po niya lahat, may mga instances naman po na minsan ‘yung iba lang ang kukunin niya, ‘yung iba pa-deposit po niya, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Mr. Counsel, Mr. Counsel?

MR. MENDOZA. At pagkatapos namang kinuha niya sa iyo hindi mo na alam kung saan niya dinala ano?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. MR. Mendoza?

MR. MENDOZA. I beg your pardon.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. We had agreed during the conference that we shall have a break of 15 minutes from 3:45 to 4 o’clock and then the second would be at 5:45 to 6 o’clock.

MR. MENDOZA. Thank you very much.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Can we now have a break of 15 minutes for the counsel to rest for a little while.

REP. APOSTOL. Mr. Chief Justice, before we recess…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

REP. APOSTOL. …may I request that the witness be allowed to go to the comfort room accompanied by a court official, by an official of the Senate.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Do we have a female official of the Senate Impeachment Court to accompany the witness?

We have. We have a lady page. The lady page should accompany. Nobody else should be with the witness except the lady page. Suspended for…

REP. APOSTOL. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Nobody should talk to the witness.

Fifteen minutes break.

THE TRIAL WAS SUSPENDED AT 3:46 P.M.

THE TRIAL WAS RESUMED AT 4:02 P.M.

THE SERGEANT AT ARMS. Please all rise. The Honorable Chief Justice, Hilario G. Davide, Jr., and the Honorable Senate President, Aquilino Q. Pimentel, Jr.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Trial is resumed.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Would you call for the prosecution panel?

REP. APOSTOL. We are ready, please.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

Madam Witness, you are still under the same oath.

MR. Mendoza, you may continue with the cross-examination.

MR. MENDOZA. Sinabi po ninyo na iyong mga dinadala ni Bonito Singson, na kapatid ni Governor Singson, dinideposito din ninyo sa bangko?

MS. LIM. Iyong iba lang po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At iyong iba, binibigay sa kanya?

MS. LIM. Binibigay ko po kay Governor Singson, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, balikan ko lang iyong kung kailan niya sinabi sa inyo na koleksiyon sa jueteng para kay Presidente Estrada.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Madam Witness, would you speak closer to the microphone?

MR. MENDOZA. Iyon namang sinabi sa inyo, kayong dalawa ni Mrs. Itchon, ganoon din ang sinabi sa inyo ni Governor Singson na iyong pera galing sa jueteng para kay Presidente Estrada, eh nasaan naman kayo noon?

MS. LIM. Nasa second floor, LCS Building, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Opisina ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, ano naman ang pagkakataon na nasabi sa inyo ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. May deliveries na naman po noon, tapos nakikita po ni Governor Singson na … Bago po kasi si Mrs. Itchon noon. Nagtataka rin po siya bakit may ganoong kalaki ang natatanggap po namin, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Noon ba Enero rin ng 1999 o Pebrero na noon?

MS. LIM. February na po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Natatandaan mo kung noong okasyon na iyon sino ang nag-deliver ng pera?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko na po matandaan, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi mo na matandaan.

Iyan bang mga account na kung saan mo dinideposito iyan ni Governor Singson, isang account ba lamang iyan?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At iyon ang account na lumalabas doon sa mga dokumentong mga exhibits na na-identify mo kanina?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong sa account na iyon, na-kaninong pangalan iyon?

MS. LIM. Pangalan po ni Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Siya lang, sa pangalan lang niya, walang kasama?

MS. LIM. Wala po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano iyan, savings account?

MS. LIM. Bale automatic transfer account po pagka .. mag-combine na po iyong savings at saka checking, Your Honor. Pero idine…

MR. MENDOZA. All of the exhibits?

MS. LIM. Pero iyong dinidepositohan ko savings, savings po iyon.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, mayroon din siyang current account?

MS. LIM. Mayroon po siyang tinatawag po nila iyon ATA, ATA, automatic transfer account.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero hindi mo alam iyong current account?

MS. LIM. Iyong number po?

MR. MENDOZA. Oo.

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po kabisado, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero hindi ka nakakapag-deposito roon?

MS. LIM. Minsan din po, Your Honor, nakakapag-deposit din po ako doon.

MR. MENDOZA. Ikaw ba’y nakakapag-withdraw rin?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Puro deposit lang?

MS. LIM. Bale ang mangyayari lang po, encashment kung may ii-issue si Gob na tseke, puwedeng ako po ang mag-encash, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, paminsan-minsan, gagawa ng tseke si Governor Singson, tapos pupunta ka sa bangko, ika-cash mo doon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At iyong tsekeng iyon drawn against the account in Metrobank?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Itong savings account, may passbook ito ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At sino naman ang nagtatago ng passbook?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ikaw. Ah ikaw ang nagtatago ng passbook? Hindi mo na ibinibigay iyan kay Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Saan mo naman itinatago iyong passbook?

MS. LIM. Doon po sa drawer ko po sa LCS Building — second floor, LCS Building, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyang account na ‘yan lumalaki ano? Minsan maraming pera ang nandiyan ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, pinapakita ko sa iyo itong mga … nandito na ba lahat?

VOICE. Lahat po. Yes.

REP. BATERINA. Everything is there.

MR. MENDOZA. I am just asking whether the …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes?

MR. MENDOZA. … all the exhibits are here now?

REP. BATERINA. The exhibits that were identified…

MR. MENDOZA. Which the witness identified.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. That would be from “H” to Q”.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

MR. MENDOZA. Walang “I”? Ha? I have here Exhibit “H”, “J”. “L”, “M”, “N”, “O”, “P”, “Q” … ah, ito pala, “I”. Hindi ba ito “I”?

VOICE. Opo.

MR. MENDOZA. Maliban dito sa mga dineposito mo na pinapatunayan ng Exhibits “H”, “I”, “J”, L”, “M”, “N”, “O”. “P”, “Q”, mayroon ka pa bang ibang dineposito dito sa ac¬count na ito?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Marami pa.

MS. LIM. Marami rin po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mas marami iyong mga ibang diniposito mo dito sa account na ito kaysa dito sa mga depositong napapa¬hayag dito sa exhibits na ito, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Pakiulit po iyong tanong, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Di ito kung bibilangin natin ito, isa, dalawa, tatlo, apat, lima, anim, pito, walo, siyam na de¬posito, iyon bang mga diniposito mo sa ibang pagkakataon, higit sa siyam, maliban dito. Iyong hindi kasali rito. Sabi mo nag deposito ka rin ano?

MS. LIM. Opo.

MR. MENDOZA. O, ito, siyam na deposito iyon. Iyong mga ibang diniposito mo dito sa account na ito na hindi kasama rito sa siyam na ito, mas marami ba sa siyam, mas higit sa siyam?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Masasabi mo ba kung mga ilang beses ka pa nag deposito dito sa account na ito na hindi kasali rito sa siyam na ito?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po mabilang, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kasi marami?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi lamang siguro dalawampu?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid halu halo na iyang pinangga¬lingan nung pera roon ano?

MS. LIM. Iyong account po na …

MR. MENDOZA. Oo.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, sabi mo hawak mo iyong passbook?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, kung mayroong magwi withdraw, kailangan iyong passbook ano?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ang ibig mo bang sabihin, makakapag withdraw dito sa savings account na hindi ginagamit ang passbook?

MS. LIM. Kasi po, tseke po ang ini isyu ni Governor Singson, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, pero samakatuwid ang maaari lamang kumuha ng pera rito, si Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At ang ginagamit naman niya sa pag withdraw tseke dahil sa automatic transfer, tama ba ‘yun?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero iyong balanse nung account nakikita mo roon sa passbook ano?

MS. LIM. Yes…

MR. MENDOZA. Pagka pinaa update mo ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At hindi rin masyadong lumalaki kasi mayroong nawi withdraw ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Madaming beses ang withdrawal ano?

MS. LIM. Marami rin po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, itong mga … palagay natin ano, itong Exhibit “H” ano, sa nakikita ko rito, itong deposit na ito ay tseke, PNB Naga, P1,155,000. Paki tingnan mo nga at pakisabi mo lang kung kailan ginawa itong depositong ito sapagkat hindi ko makita eh, iyong petsa.

MS. LIM. Nung ano po, May 7, 1999, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. May 7, 1999. Ngayon, itong tsekeng ito, natatandaan mo ba kung papanong umabot sa iyo?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko na po matandaan iyong eksaktong nangyari po, puwedeng idineliber (deliver) noong messenger po ni Mr. Anton Prieto deretso po sa akin, ako po mismo ang nag receive o puwede rin po na ang nag receive po si Governor Singson o kaya si Ms. Menchu Itchon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, hindi mo masasabi sa iyong kaalaman mismo kung papanong nakarating itong tseke doon sa opisina ninyo?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko matandaan iyong eksaktong nangyari, Your Honor, basta karamihan po itong deposit na ito deliveries po.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero hindi mo matandaan kung ikaw ang tumanggap, kung si Mrs. Itchon o kung iba pang tao? Ano, hindi ba gano’n?

MS. LIM. Bale tatlo lang po kaming tumatanggap doon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kaya pero hindi mo malaman, matandaan kung sino sa inyong tatlo ang tumanggap?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi mo rin alam kung sino ang nagdala noong tseke roon?

MS. LIM. Automatic po, pagka PNB Naga o saka kung si Gov. naman po ang pinagbigyan noong tseke, sinasabi po niya, “Oh, ideposit mo na iyong galing kay Anton Prieto” o kaya minsan po itinatanong ni Gov. sa akin na, “Oh, na clear ba iyong idineposit mo na galing kay Anton?” Iyon po ang sinasabi po niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero ikaw, hindi mo alam kung sa iyong kaalaman mismo, hindi mo alam kung kaninong account ito?

MS. LIM. Ang alin po? Iyong…

MR. MENDOZA. Itong PNB. Hindi ka naman pumupunta sa PNB Naga para magtanong, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Hindi po. Hindi ko po pinuntahan ang PNB Naga po pero iyan na po ang palatandaan namin na pag PNB Naga, galing na po kay Mr. Anton Prieto, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ang nagsabi sa iyo doon noon ay si Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Iyon na galing po.

MR. MENDOZA. Na itong pagka PNB Naga, galing iyan kay Anton Prieto sapagkat sinabi sa iyo iyon ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. At saka kung ako po ang mismong nakakatanggap po iyong tseke, Your Honor, tapos binubuksan ko naman po, nakikita ko po mismo, PNB Naga po.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo nga, iyong tseke PNB Naga. Hindi natin pinag uusapan iyon kasi makikita mo naman sa tseke kung PNB Naga, hindi ba? Hindi ba sa tseke basahin mo lang makikita mo kung PNB Naga, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi ba sa tseke makikita mo rin kung kanino iyong tseke. Kung minsan nakaimprenta iyong pangalan noong may tseke sa itaas.

MS. LIM. Iyong account name po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, account name. Ito ba may account name?

MS. LIM. Di ako sigurado po kung saan po dito pero may time na nakatang…

MR. MENDOZA. Teka, teka muna. Pinag uusapan lang natin itong Exhibit “H”, eh. Tingnan mong mabuti.

REP. BATERINA. May we ask…

MR. MENDOZA. Matatandaan mo ba kung itong tsekeng ito mayroong account name?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Itinatanong ko lang sa iyo para malaman ko kung doon sa tseke, nandodoon iyong pangalan ni Anton Prieto?

REP. BATERINA. The best evidence would be the document itself.

MR. MENDOZA. I am on cross examination.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The witness is being cross examined on the basis of the evidence precisely.

Witness may answer.

MR. MENDOZA. Ang tanong ko sa iyo, diyan sa lahat ng tsekeng iyan na sinasabi mong galing kay Anton Prieto, nakita mo ba ang pangalang Anton Prieto sa tseke?

MS. LIM. Basta may natanggap po ako, Your Honor, na tseke na may nakalagay po doon iyong account name, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi. Ang tinatanong ko sa iyo kung itong sa itong lahat ng tsekeng ito na natanggap mo na idineposito mo, mayroon ka bang tsekeng nakita na nandodoon iyong pangalan ni Anton Prieto?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan kung naideposit ko po iyong tseke na iyon noon, Your Honor, basta sigurado akong may nakita ako noon pero hindi ko sigurado kung idineposit ko sa account ni Governor Singson o kaya ibinigay ko po kay Mrs. Yolanda Ricaforte.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, kagaya nito, Exhibit “H”, hindi mo masasabi kung iyong pangalan ni Anton Prieto naandito, ano?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong palagi mong sinasabi kung PNB Naga galing iyan kay Anton Prieto. Hindi ba iyan ay sinasabi mo lang dahil sinabi sa iyo ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Sinasabi ko rin po at saka napatunayan ko rin po kasi nakakatanggap din po ako.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, kanino mo Sino ang nagbibigay sa iyo?

MS. LIM. Mga messengers po ni Mr. Anton Prieto, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Papaano mo naman alam na messenger ni Anton Prieto iyon?

MS. LIM. Kasi iyon po ang pakilala nila sa akin, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyon bang messenger na iyon natatandaan mo ba ang mga pangalan?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ni hindi mo natatandaan siguro ang mukha n’ong mga ‘yon, eh.

MS. LIM. Paiba-iba po kasi ang inuutusan niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Paiba-iba. Samakatuwid, opinion mo ‘yon na ‘yon, eh, messenger ni Anton Prieto, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, kasi ‘yon po ang pagpapakilala po nila pag umakyat sila sa opisina, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, pagpapakilala nila. Okay. ‘Yon, tanggapin natin ‘yon, ‘yon ang natatandaan mo-nagpakilala. At pag-deliver naman ng tseke, ano ang sinasabi, “Padala po ni Anton Prieto ito”? Ganoon lang?

MS. LIM. Ang sinasabi po nila kadalasan, “Pakibigay ito kay Gob. galing kay Mr. Anton Prieto,” sabi.

MR. MENDOZA. Ganoon lang?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Wala namang sinasabing galing sa jueteng ito?

MS. LIM. Wala na po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Lalo nang hindi sinasabing para kay Presidente ito, ano?

MS. LIM. Wala po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Wala. Wala. Oo.

Tingnan mong mabuti itong mga exhibits na panay PNB Naga, ha. Ngayon, mayroong mga petsa itong deposit slip nito, eh. ‘Yan bang mga tsekeng ‘yan, eh, natanggap mo doon sa petsang lumalabas dito sa mga deposit slip?

MS. LIM. Hindi po eksaktong petsa, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero nalalapit na roon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, kanina, mayroon kang sinabi rin na ang nag-abot sa ‘yo n’ong envelope na mayroong tseke si Anton Prieto, ano? Kahapon yata-n’ong….

MS. LIM. N’ong Friday po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, n’ong Friday-di ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ilang beses kang inabutan ng envelope ni, sinasabi mo, ni Anton Prieto, na mayroong tseke?

MS. LIM. Minsan lang po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Isang beses lang. Alin dito? Paki-sabi mo lang dito.

MS. LIM. Wala po dito, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, wala dito sa mga exhibit na ito?

MS. LIM. Wala po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Bakit? Anong nangyari roon sa tsekeng ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Eh, nandito po, dala n’ong mga ano n’ong Friday.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano?

MS. LIM. Dala po n’ong mga prosecutors; dala po namin n’ong Friday, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi, hindi mo natatandaan kung hindi mo makikita ang papel kung anong nangyari doon sa tsekeng ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Matandaan ko po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O, anong nangyari doon sa tsekeng ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Tumalbog po, Your Honor, ibinalik.

MR. MENDOZA. Tumalbog. Noon mo lamang nakilala si Anton Prieto?

MS. LIM. Noong ibinigay po niya sa akin ang sobre.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yong envelope?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At sinasabi mong si Anton Prieto ‘yon sapagkat ang pagkakatanda mo, ‘yong taong nakita mo sa Dusit Hotel, sinabi niya si Anton Prieto siya?

MS. LIM. Siya po. ‘Yon po ang pagpapakilala niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero bago n’on, hindi mo nakikita pa ‘yang si Anton Prieto.

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi mo rin nalalaman kung siya nga si Anton Prieto maliban lang na sinabi niya siya si Anton Prieto, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, napakarami nitong mga exhibits na ipinahayag sa iyo ng prosecution, mayroon ka bang…? Bago ka nagtestigo dito, n’ong Biyernes, mayroon ka na bang mga papel na ibinigay sa mga prosecutors…?

MS. LIM. Ano…?

MR. MENDOZA. Sa mga dokumentong kinilala mo, inaydentipay (identified) mo?

MS. LIM. Ito po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ito. Ibinigay mo sa kanila?

MS. LIM. Ipinakita ko lang po ‘yon.

MR. MENDOZA. Ipinakita mo. Kailan mo unang ipinakita sa mga prosecutors ito?

MS. LIM. N’ong…. Hindi ko na po matandaan, Your Honor, pero… hindi ko matandaan ‘yong eksaktong ano, pero n’ong… before itong impeachment. Basta bago po mag-umpisa ang impeachment.

MR. MENDOZA. Bago pa mag-umpisa ito?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kailan mo inipon ito?

MS. LIM. Basta ano po… may ano po kasi, may file po ako niyan tuwing may deposit slip po ako o kaya may ibigay sa akin ni Governor Singson o mga kasamahan ko, pinapayl (filed) ko po. May file po ako mismo.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero mayroon bang nag-utos sa iyo na ikaw, nilikom mong lahat itong mga deposits na ito doon sa mga file mo ng deposit slips?

MS. LIM. Tungkol dito po?

MR. MENDOZA. Ha?

MS. LIM. Tungkol dito, ‘yong paglikom?

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Sinong nag-utos sa iyo, kung mayroon man, na ‘yang mga deposit slip na ‘yan, ipunin mo?

MS. LIM. Bale sinabihan po ako ni Governor Singson na maghalungkat po ako ng files ko, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Si Governor Singson ang nag-utos sa ‘yo….

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. … na ipunin mo ito. Papaano naman ang pagkakautos sa ‘yo? Ano ang sinabi ni Governor Singson sa ‘yo?

MS. LIM. Ang sabi po niya, “Di ba ‘yong mga tsekeng idine-deposit na galing kay Anton mayroon kang kopya?” sabi po niya sa akin, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yon lang ang sabi niya sa ‘yo?

MS. LIM. ‘Yon ang sabi niya.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yon ang ipunin mong mga deposit slip.

MS. LIM. Sabi po niya ‘yong, “Basta halungkatin mo ‘yong mga deposit slips, ‘yong mga tseke na galing kay Anton Prieto,” sabi po niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyon lang ang sabi niya sa iyo?

MS. LIM. Iyon ang sabi po niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At ‘ika niya, inipon mo ito?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, iyong deposit slip sa cash, nasaan…Hindi ba kasali iyon?

MS. LIM. Dito sa ano po?

MR. MENDOZA. Oo.

MS. LIM. Hindi po.

MR. MENDOZA. Wala ba dito iyong deposit slip tungkol doon sa cash na sinabi mong natanggap mo kay Bong Pineda?

MS. LIM. Wala pong dini deposit po na cash galing po kay Mr. Bong Pineda, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, iyong sinabi mong kinuha mo kay Bong Pineda o doon sa kapatid niya, hindi mo dineposito iyon?

MS. LIM. Iyong galing po kay Mr. Bong Pineda, Your Honor, hindi ko dineposit. Pero iyong deliveries na galing sa kapatid ni Governor Singson, iyon po ang…iyong iba ang dineposit ko.

MR. MENDOZA. Teka, baka makalimutan natin iyong galing sa kapatid ni Bong Pineda. Saan mo dinala iyong pera?

MS. LIM. Iniuwi ko po sa LCS office, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sa office. Pagkatapos, saan napunta roon sa opisina?

MS. LIM. Tinurn-over ko po kay Governor Chavit Singson, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, kay Governor Singson mo rin ibinigay?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, iyong cash galing sinabi mo kay Mayor Estrada, iyon eh, hindi mo rin dineposito?

MS. LIM. Hindi rin po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi pina deposito sa iyo?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, kanino mo naman ibinigay?

MS. LIM. Ibinigay ko po kay Governor Singson, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kanina sinabi mo iyong perang iyon para kay Presidente Estrada, ano, iyong galing kay Mayor Estrada?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, ayun. Sinabi ba ni Governor Singson sa iyo iyon?

MS. LIM. Iyong cash…

MR. MENDOZA. Na iyong perang galing kay Mayor Estrada para kay Presidente Estrada?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sabi ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Sabi po niya “Huwag kayong maingay,” huwag daw po akong maingay.

MR. MENDOZA. Huwag maingay. At alam naman, si Mayor Estrada, anak ni Presidente Estrada, ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kanya pinakuha ka ng pera kay Mayor Estrada para ibigay sa tatay niya, pero hindi mo sa tatay ibinigay, ibinigay kay Governor Singson, ano? Ganoon ang nangyari ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, ganoon. Ngayon, sinabi mo na itong mga papel na ito ibinigay mo sa mga prosecutor bago pa magbista dito? Natatandaan mo ba kung kailan iyon?

MS. LIM. Basta hindi ko po matandaan iyong eksaktong araw saka eksaktong date po, basta bago ho mag umpisa ang impeachment trial.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, iyong buwan, matatandaan mo ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano’ng buwan?

MS. LIM. Ah, late November na po.

MR. MENDOZA. November?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Ngayon, ikaw ba’y nagtestigo roon sa Blue Ribbon Committee?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi ka pumunta roon?

MS. LIM. Pumunta po ako, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Noong pumunta ka sa Blue Ribbon Committee, ito bang mga papel na ito ay nasa sa iyo na, nalikom mo na o hindi pa?

MS. LIM. Ah, nalikom ko na po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero, hindi mo pa ipinaalam kay Governor Singson itong lahat na papel na ito noong mayroon pang mga imbestigasyon sa Blue Ribbon Committee?

MS. LIM. Ah, alam na po niya na nahanap ko na ho, pero ipinatago lang po niya sa akin muna, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, samakatuwid lahat ng ito, noong mayroong…Ah, teka muna, alam mo noong nag testify si Governor Singson sa Blue Ribbon Committee, ano hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At noong nag testify siya doon, alam na niyang lahat ito, ano?

MS. LIM. Tungkol sa deposits po?

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, itong mga deposit slips.

MS. LIM. Alam na po niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Alam na niya, Oo. Sinabi mo na sa kanya?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Ngayon, bago ka naman magtestigo rito, magdeklara rito, ikaw ba’y kinausap ng mga prosecutors?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Maraming beses?

MS. LIM. Marami rin po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroon ilang beses?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po mabilang, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi po mabilang sapagkat maraming beses?

MS. LIM. Kasi po, tanong po sila nang tanong.

MR. MENDOZA. O, tanong nang tanong. Paulit ulit?

MS. LIM. Basta paulit ulit tinatanong po ako.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Hindi ba ikaw ay nanungkulan bilang Kabataang Barangay?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano ang panunungkulan mong Kabataang Barangay?

MS. LIM. Ako po ang KB Chairman sa barangay namin noon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sa Ilocos Sur?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, tinulungan ka naman ni Gov. Singson sigurong maging chairman ano?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, hindi, oo.

Wala na ba kayong ibang exhibits? Wala na?

REP. BATERINA. We have submitted to the Honorable Estelito Mendoza a deposit slip, Mr. Chief Justice.

MR. MENDOZA. Walang exhibit number ito.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Has it been identified before?

REP. BATERINA. Ito po.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. As an exhibit?

May we have the answer?

REP. BATERINA. The exhibit number the exhibit is Exhibit “G 1″ and Exhibit “I”, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “G”?

REP. BATERINA. Exhibit “G” and Exhibit “G 1″, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. MR. Mendoza, do you have any question on the exhibits just submitted to you by counsel?

REP. BATERINA. And we are also submitting to the former Solicitor General, Exhibit “G” and Exhibit “R”, Mr. Chief Justice.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano ngang taon ka naging KB Chairman Kabataang Barangay Chairman?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan iyong eksakto po. Basta ang natatandaan ko iyong kauna unahang nagkaroon po ng election noon ng KB Chairman, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ang taon hindi mo matandaan?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko na po basta ang alam ko po ano na po ako noon KB member qualified na po ako as KB member, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Di ba iyan malaking karangalan iyan ‘no, naging chairman ka ng Kabataang Barangay, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Opo, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, lalo mo na sigurong hindi matatandaan kung anong buwan, ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Ngayon, di ba noong tumira ka doon sa LCS Building, si Gov. Singson, doon din siya natutulog, ano? Mayroon siyang parang kuwarto sa itaas, ano?

MS. LIM. Doon po sa fourth floor, bahay po niya iyon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, bahay niya. Samakatuwid doon tumitira si Gov. Singson noon ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Anong taon tumira si Gov. Singson doon?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan. Basta noong na renovate na po iyong building niya. Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, oo. Ngayon, mayroon kang isinalaysay kanina tungkol doon sa pagpupunta sa Malacañang, ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano’ng pangalan noong driver?

MS. LIM. Faus, po.

MR. MENDOZA. Ha?

MS. LIM. Faus.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano?

MS. LIM. Faus.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi ko maintindihan, puwede mo bang i spelling iyon?

MS. LIM. F a u s. Faus.

MR. MENDOZA. Wala bang apelyido iyan?

MS. LIM. Ang alam ko po, Prudencio Faus Prudencio.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi ka sigurado?

MS. LIM. Iyon po ang alam ko.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero matagal nang driver ni Gov. Singson iyan?

MS. LIM. Matagal na rin po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, iyon namang security, ano’ng pangalan?

MS. LIM. Ang pangalan po niya, Frederico Artates, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Matagal na ring security ni Gov. Singson iyan?

MS. LIM. Matagal na rin po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Siya ba’y nagtrabaho sa kay Gov. Singson eh, nauna pa sa iyo?

MS. LIM. Nauna po ako sa kanya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Konti lang?

MS. LIM. Siguro nauna po ako ng isang taon lang, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Isang taon lang. Mga Ilocano rin ba iyan?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ilocos Sur din?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyan ba’y taga kababayan mo?

MS. LIM. Taga-Vigan po siya, taga-Bantay po ako, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, oo. Ngayon, ano naman ‘yong auto? Auto ba ‘yon o jeep na sinakyan ninyo?

MS. LIM. Ano po, Expedition.

MR. MENDOZA. Expedition.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Noong pumunta sa LCS Building, sabi mo no’ng 1999 ito, eh, 1999?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano’ng buwan?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan ‘yong buwan, Your Honor. Pero ang natatandaan ko, ‘yong time na ‘yon noon, mainit ‘yong issue tungkol kay Maslog.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero, ‘yon ba’y Ito lang, ito’ng beses na ito lang na ikaw ay nakapunta sa Malacañang?

MS. LIM. ‘Yan po ‘yong

MR. MENDOZA. Itong beses na ito lang, isang beses ka lang pumunta sa Malacañang.

MS. LIM. Hindi. Napunta na rin po ako noon, matagal na, noong ang presidente pa po, eh, si President Cory Aquino, pero matagal na po ‘yon.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero sa’yo, malaking karanasan ‘yong pagpupunta sa Malacañang, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Oo naman po.

MR. MENDOZA. Mahalagang karanasan ‘yon, ano?

MS. LIM. Oo naman po.

MR. MENDOZA. Lalo na kung makikita mo ang presidente, ano?

MS. LIM. Oo naman po.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero hindi mo matandaan kung anong buwan.

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Enero, Pebrero, Marso, Abril, Mayo, Hunyo, Hulyo, hindi mo matandaan?

MS. LIM. Basta ang matandaan ko lang po, mainit iyong issue noon tungkol kay Maslog, Your Honor. (Laughter)

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, lalo mo nang hindi matatandaan siguro ‘yong petsa, ano, kung hindi mo matatandaan ‘yong buwan, ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, ‘yong araw, matatandaan mo?

MS. LIM. Hindi rin po, Your Honor. Basta ang alam ko noon, weekdays kasi may opisina ako.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, di Expedition. Saan nanggaling ‘yong Expedition, ‘yong sasakyan no’ng pumunta sa LCS Building, saan nanggaling ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po alam, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi mo alam? Pero tumawag sa’yo si Governor Singson. Sabi niya, “Samahan mo itong driver at saka ‘yong security, may dalang pera.”

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yong pera, nandoon na sa loob ng sasakyan?

MS. LIM. Dala dala na po nila, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Dala dala na niya. Samakatuwid, kung saan man nanggaling ‘yan papunta sa LCS Building, wala namang kasama ‘yong pera kung hindi ‘yong driver at saka ‘yong security, ano?

MS. LIM. Tatlo po sila, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, tatlo. Mayroon pang isa. Sino pa?

MS. LIM. ‘Yong isang aide po ni Governor Singson.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano?

MS. LIM. Isang aide po niya.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano’ng pangalan?

MS. LIM. Gemys, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Lalaki rin?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O, ‘yon nga. Samakatuwid, noong mula man nilagay ‘yong pera roon, kung saan man nanggaling ‘yong Expedition, pumunta sa LCS Building, walang kasama ‘yong pera kung hindi itong tatlong ito.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At hindi mo naman alam kung sino ang naglagay ng pera roon.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, pagdating doon, paano mong nalaman na nandodoon na ‘yong Expedition?

MS. LIM. Tinawag po ako noong security niya, Your Honor. Umakyat po sa 2nd floor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, tinawag ka.

MS. LIM. Opo.

MR. MENDOZA. Mga ano’ng oras ng araw ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Basta before lunch po ‘yon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Tapos bumaba ka.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Nakaparada ‘yong Expedition sa harap?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Doon ba sa harapan ng building na ‘yon mayroong parking space?

MS. LIM. Mayroon po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroon bang ibang sasakyan na nakaparada noong bumaba ka at nakita mo ‘yong Expedition?

MS. LIM. Mayroon naman po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Marami ba?

MS. LIM. Hindi naman ganoon karami.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroon bang mga taong nandodoon sa kapaligiran noon?

MS. LIM. ‘Yong ano po, ‘yong security po ng building, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ng building.

MS. LIM. Yes, sir.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, ano ba’ng kolor no’ng Expedition na ‘yon?MS. LIM. Red po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ha?

MS. LIM. Red.

MR. MENDOZA. Red.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ito ba ‘yong bulletproof?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, hindi. Okay. Ngayon, di sumakay ka sa Expedition.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Saan? Sa likod?

MS. LIM. Sa ano po, doon sa likuran po ng driver, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Likuran ng driver. Saan mo naman nakita ‘yong pera pagsakay mo?

MS. LIM. Pagsakay ko po, nandoon sa likuran. Bale, driver po, tapos ako, tapos doon sa likuran.

MR. MENDOZA. Uhmmn. At sinabi mo sa driver at sa security, “Bago tayo umalis, bibilangin ko muna itong pera.”

MS. LIM. Ang sabi ko po, “Sabi ni Gov. i check ko daw kung tama ‘yong laman no’ng bag.” ‘Yon ang sabi ko po.

MR. MENDOZA. Para bang sa intindi mo kay Governor Singson, hindi niya alam kung ilan ang pera roon?

MS. LIM. Alam po niya pero nagsigurado lang po siguro, Your Honor.MR. MENDOZA. Ang ibig mong sabihin, alam ni Governor Singson kung magkano ang pera roon. Naniniguro siya na mula sa pinanggalingan at umabot sa LCS Building hindi nabawasan siguro, ano?

MS. LIM. Siguro po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kaya pinatingnan sa iyo?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, nasa loob ka ng auto, ng Expedition?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano ba iyong kinalalagyan ‘ka mo ng pera?

MS. LIM. Iyong black bag po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ha?

MS. LIM. Black bag.

MR. MENDOZA. Black.

MS. LIM. Na bag.

MR. MENDOZA. Bag.

MS. LIM. Iyong parang attache case.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh, ano ba iyong bag? Canvass bag ba iyan, o shopping bag, o attache case? So, anong klaseng bag?

MS. LIM. Canvass po. Iyong may ano pa — parang ganoon po. Pero iyon may mga bulsa-bulsa, saka may gulong po iyon. Iyong sa kay Gov., wala pong gulong, walang bulsa-bulsa.

MR. MENDOZA. Walang gulong.

REP. BATERINA. Mr. Chief Justice, may I interrupt. The witness is referring to the bag of the cross-examiner (Laughter), which is a bag that is big and which measures about eight inches in width.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Do we have the tape measure already?

MR. MENDOZA. I think we better get a measurement.

MS. LIM. Mas mataba po ito, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Teka, sandali, sandali, sandali. Maghintay ka lang at tatanungin kita.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. I think earlier there was a move to look for a tape measure to measure precisely the distance.

REP. BATERINA. May we ask that the bag be placed up on the…

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi, ito, ito. Halika rito tingnan mo. The width of the bag is…

REP. BATERINA. May I ask that the…

MR. MENDOZA. Maybe the secretary…

REP. BATERINA. …secretary general…

MR. MENDOZA. …if Your Honor please, can do the measuring.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. That is correct. The secretary of the Senate is requested to take the measurements.

MR. MENDOZA. I am not very good at numbers.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. And that the two counsels should make the observation.

REP. BATERINA. Can we place it on top of the table of the witness, Mr. Chief Justice?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. If that could be accommodated, why not.

MR. MENDOZA. Sabihin mo, width, length, height.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Make of record the measurement.

REP. BATERINA. Nine and a half inches.

THE SECRETARY. Nine, sir.

MR. MENDOZA. Width.

REP. BATERINA. That’s the width. That’s the width of the bag, nine and a half inches.

MR. MENDOZA. Ha?

REP. BATERINA. Nine and a half.

MR. MENDOZA. Saan ba iyong nine and a half?

THE SECRETARY. Iyan, nine.

REP. BATERINA. Diyan.

MR. MENDOZA. Nine and a half, nine and a half inches wide, width.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The length?

REP. BATERINA. And the height is something like…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. No, not something like. You have a measurement there. Make it correct.

REP. BATERINA. Fourteen and a half.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Fourteen and a half inches.

REP. BATERINA. Fourteen and a half.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi, fourteen and one-fourth lang. Fourteen and one-fourth.

REP. BATERINA. Fourteen and one-fourth.

MR. MENDOZA. Fourteen and one-fourth.

REP. BATERINA. The former solicitor general is correct, Your Honors.

And the length is…

MR. MENDOZA. Eighteen.

REP. BATERINA. …eighteen inches, Mr. Chief Justice. And it is a black leather bag.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi leather iyan, canvass.

REP. BATERINA. Canvass.

MR. MENDOZA. Leatherette lang. Mura lang iyan.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Probably we should rather get the description by the owner.

REP. BATERINA. Thank you, Your Honors.

MR. MENDOZA. Ilalapit ko sa inyo ito. Pakitingnan lang ninyong mabuti. Iyon bang bag mas malaki rito, mas maliit dito, kasing-laki nito?

MS. LIM. Mas mataba po ito, Your Honor. Mas payat konti iyon. Tapos ito kasi may mga bulsa-bulsa. Iyon wala pong bulsa saka…

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi bale na iyong mga bulsa-bulsa. Pero mas malapad ba doon, o mas mahaba doon, o ano? Mas maliit o mas malaki?

MS. LIM. Basta iyong ano po niya, ito mas mataba po. Iyon mas payat po. Tapos iyong — ito kasi nag-curve po sa baba niya. Iyon corner po, eh. Hanggang — dito sa taas niya may corner, doon sa baba may corner din po.

MR. MENDOZA. Teka, itataas ko uli, ano. Itataas ko uli.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Will you kindly describe slowly?

MR. MENDOZA. Ang sabi mo, iyong bag mas payat dito?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pahiram ng panukat.

REP. BATERINA. Your Honor, Mr. Chief Justice, there is another bag of the Honorable Flaminiano, may we borrow it? (Laughter)

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Was it pointed too by the witness? Did the witness…

REP. BATERINA. Your Honor, because the bag of the former solicitor general is very fat.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. No, no. Excuse me, order, please. Order, please. So, did the witness point to another bag?

MR. MENDOZA. Ito, pakitingnan lang ninyo kung gaano kalapad ‘yon? Ito kasi, sinukat natin kanina, ilan ang sabi natin? Ang sabi natin, 9 1/2 inches. Mga ilang inches ‘yong taba ng bag? ‘Yan, eight.

MS. LIM. Mga eight po. Kung hindi ako nagkamali, mga eight. Basta hindi ho siya ganito kataba, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. With the aid of the tape measure, Witness o, tingnan mo, may we stipulate that the witness is suggesting a width of stating a width of eight inches, eight inches.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, ‘yon namang taas, taas?

MS. LIM. Ito po, mas mataas na po ito kasi magkapatong na po ‘yong takip, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Eh …

MS. LIM. Makapal na masyado ‘yong takip.

MR. MENDOZA. … sukatan mo kung gaano kaya kataas ‘yon? Ayan.

MS. LIM. Siguro po mga 12 po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, mga 12.

REP. BATERINA. Twelve inches.

MR. MENDOZA. May we stipulate…

MS. LIM. Eleven to twelve. Basta eleven…

REP. BATERINA. Accepted.

MR. MENDOZA. Ha, ilan?

MS. LIM. Mag umpisa po sa 11 to 12, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eleven to 12 inches.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What is that?

REP. BATERINA. The height.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. It’s the height.

MR. MENDOZA. The height.

MR. BATERINA. The height of the bag of the Honorable Mendoza, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Is that the height of the bag or the height, according to the witness, of the bag that she brought with her?

MR. MENDOZA. With the use of a tape measure, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The length.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatwid, ‘yong bag na ‘yon, mas maliit dito, ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Teka muna, sa akin ito, eh. Pagka ito ang mabasa mo, magkamali ka ng sagot.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed, MR. Mendoza.

MR. MENDOZA. Yes, sir. With the permission of the Senate.

Di binuksan mo ‘yong bag?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Nakita mo pera?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano, tigwa one thousand peso bills?

MS. LIM. Tigwa one thousand po ‘yon.

MR. MENDOZA. Lahat?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Binilang mo?

MS. LIM. Bundle count po, Your Honor.

MR. MEMDOZA. Bundle count. ‘Yong sinasabi mong bundle count, ang ibig mong sabihin, eh, isang bundle…

MS. LIM. Isang bundle po, isang milyon na po.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero, doon sa bundle ng isang milyon na ‘yon, wala na bang smaller bundles na … Kasi, kung ‘yong one thousand, pupunta ka sa bangko, bibigyan ka ng mga perang tigwa one thousand, usually naka bundle ‘yon, isang bundle, isangdaan na bills eh na tigwa one thousand, ang ibig sabihin noon, 100,000?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yon bang sinasabi mong bundle count na one million, mayroon pa ring naka bundle na tigwa one hundred thousand?

MS. LIM. Bale ano po ‘yon, kung isang bundle na one million po, may naka bundle pa din po na tigwa one hundred thousand po. Bale 10 bundles po na tigwa one thousand…

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, ‘yong sinasabi mong ‘yong bundle na one million, sampung bundle ‘yon? Sampung bundle na tigwa one hundred thousand, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O, ngayon, pumunta kayo sa Greenhills sa San Juan?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kasama mo ‘yong tatlo?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pumunta kayo doon sa Polk Street?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yon ba ang unang unang beses mong pumunta doon, o nakapunta ka na roon?

MS. LIM. ‘Yon po ‘yong unang punta ko.

MR. MEND0ZA. Unang unang beses. Eh papaano mo naman nalaman na ‘yon ang bahay ni Pangulo?

MS. LIM. Kasi, dinala po ako ng driver po niya at saka security po niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, samakatwid, ang may alam noong bahay ‘yong driver at security?

MS. LIM. At saka ‘yong aide po. Tatlo po sila.

MR. MENDOZA. At saka ‘yong aide, oo. Pagdating doon mga ilang minuto kaya ang tinakbo n’yo mula sa LCS hanggang doon?

MS. LIM. Mga ano po, kulang kulang po ng isang oras.

MR. MENDOZA. Halos isang oras?

MS. LIM. Hindi naman po kami inabot ng isang oras, Your Honor. Mga 30 to 45 minutes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ma traffic ba noon?

MS. LIM. Ma traffic din po kasi ‘yong mga ganoong oras …

MR. MENDOZA. May pasok ba noon?

MS. LIM. Sigurado po akong may pasok kasi nasa office po ako noon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, pagkatapos noon, ang sabi mo bumaba ‘yong, security ba?

MS. LIM. ‘Yong security po at saka ‘yong aide?

MR. MENDOZA. Ano ang pangalan noon?

MS. LIM. Federico Artates, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At mayroon siyang kinausap doon?

MS. LIM. Tinanong po niya doon sa… may mga gwardiya din po doon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sinabi sa inyo maghintay kayo, ganoon ba?

MS. LIM. Siya na po ang nakipag usap po. Noong bumalik po sa sasakyan, sabi po niya, “Wala daw diyan si Malou. Hintayin natin iyong tawag ni Gob. kung ano ang sasabi…

MR. MENDOZA. Pero noong tinawagan ka ni Governor Singson para samahan sila, sinabi ba niya kung sino ang hahanapin ninyo?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sinabi niya, “Si Malou.”

MS. LIM. “Hanapin si Malou, iyong secretary ni Presidente,” sabi po niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, si Malou ang sinabi niya?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi si Presidente?

MS. LIM. Si Malou. “Hanapin ninyo si Malou, iyong secretary ni Presidente,” sabi niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O, ngayon, kilala mo ba iyong si Malou?

MS. LIM. ‘Pag makita ko mamumukhaan ko po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero bago noon kilala mo na siya?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi. Ngayon, di pagkatapos matagal tagal kayong naghintay?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Merong ilang oras?

MS. LIM. Basta po inabutan po kami ng lunch doon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Eh pero hindi natin masasabi kung gaano, kung ilang oras kung hindi mo sasabihin kung anong oras kayo dumating doon eh.

MS. LIM. Dumating po kami siguro doon mga past 11 na po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, past 11 na. Di hindi na masyadong matagal. Inabot na kayo ng alas dose?

MS. LIM. Inabot na po kami ng lunch.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong kasamahan mo naman nananghalian na doon?

MS. LIM. Nakikain na po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Nakikain na. Dahil natagalan pa, nagyaya sa iyo iyong mga kasama mo, kumain na kayo sa labas.

MS. LIM. Noong tapos na po iyong kasama naming kumain, tapos naghintay pa rin po kami, nagugutom na po kami, iyon, nagyaya po sila na kain muna po kami sa isang restaurant po sa Greenhills, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mga anong oras noon?

MS. LIM. Past 12 na po, Your Honor. Mga… siguro mga… basta’t mga past 12 na. Siguro mga 12:45. Basta ano po, pasado na po ng ano ‘yon.

MR. MENDOZA. Alam mo ba… Natatandaan mo ba iyong pangalan ng restaurant?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan pero alam ko pong puntahan kung pupunta ulit ako ngayon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Doon ba sa mall iyon, mall, o hiwalay na restaurant?

MS. LIM. Hindi po. Iyong mga restaurant po doon, iyong tabi tabi po doon sa may… Kung hindi ako nagkakamali, iyong street Annapolis pero hindi po ako sigurado. Basta iyong ano po doon, iyong mga tabi tabi na restaurant, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kayo bang lahat ay kumain?

MS. LIM. Tatlo lang po kami, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong isa?

MS. LIM. Hindi na po kumain kasi busog na daw po siya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Naiwan ba siya sa auto?

MS. LIM. Hindi po. Sumama rin po kasi uminom po siya ng ano, iyong iced tea po ang ininom niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid kayong apat eh pumunta sa restaurant?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kayong tatlo nananghalian?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong isa kumain ng iced tea?

MS. LIM. Uminom po. Hindi po kumain, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ha? Ano ang ininom?

MS. LIM. Uminom po ng iced tea. Hindi po niya kinain, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, oo, oo. Pagkakamali ko.

Akala ko kumain din kasi.

Eh ngayon, matagal ba kayo sa restaurant?

MS. LIM. Hindi naman po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Nagmamadali ba kayo?

MS. LIM. Nagmamadali po kami kasi may dala dala po kaming pera, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero iyong auto eh ipinarada ninyo ‘no, kung saan ano?

MS. LIM. Doon po sa… along sa… bale along the road po kami nagparada. Iyong may mga…

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, pinarada ninyo iyong auto?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong pera naiwan sa auto?

MS. LIM. Hindi po. Binitbit po noong security, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, ibig mong sabihin pumunta sa restaurant dala dala iyong black bag.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Di ba tinitingnan ng tao bakit may dala dalang black bag?

MS. LIM. Hindi naman po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, o, sige. Ngayon, pagkagaling doon, saan kayo pumunta?

MS. LIM. Iyon po, noong kumakain na po kami, noong ano po, iyong nagkukuwentuhan po kami kasi umiinom pa po kami ng soft drinks, iyon, tumawag po si Governor Singson kay Faus. Siya na po ang ininstrakan kung saan po kami pupunta, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, hindi ikaw ang tinawagan?

MS. LIM. Hindi po, iyong driver po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong driver?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. So paano mo naman alam na merong instruction siya sa driver?

MS. LIM. Iyong sinabi po sa akin… sa amin iyong driver, magkakaharap po kaming apat, Your Honor. Sabi niya, “Tayo na, tayo na, may ano, tumawag na si Gob. Punta na daw tayo sa Malacañang,” sabi po niya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O, pumunta na kayo sa Malacañang naman?

MS. LIM. Pumunta po kami, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyon ba ay maliban doon sa pagpunta mo noong panahon ni Presidente Cory Aquino, pangalawang beses mo lang bang… iyon lamang ba ang pagpupunta mo sa Malacañang?

MS. LIM. Iyon po ang matandaan ko, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Bago doon hindi ka pumunta doon, puwera doon sa pagpunta mo kay Presidente Aquino?

MS. LIM. Hindi… Wala po akong matatandaan na pumunta po ako bago kay Presidente Aquino, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, oo nga. Noong pumunta ka ba kay Presidente Aquino iyong pinuntahan mo nandodoon na iyon, iyong ano ba iyon? Parang building na iyon?

MS. LIM. Iyong pinuntahan ko po noong panahon po ni Presidente Aquino, hindi po pareho doon sa pinuntahan ko po noong 1999, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, eh, pumarada iyong auto?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sa tabi, sa harapan ng mga guwardya?

MS. LIM. Basta mayroon po iyong ano doon, iyong paradahan po doon na ang sabi po nila hanggang doon lang po iyong sasakyan, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ikaw lang ang bumaba?

MS. LIM. Ako lang po ang bumaba, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Bitbit bitbit mo iyong bag?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mabigat ba?

MS. LIM. Kaya ko naman po bitbitin, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero mabigat?

MS. LIM. Okay lang po, kasi sanay naman po tayo sa pagbibitbit, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero puno ba iyong bag?

MS. LIM. Hindi po napuno, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, hindi puno.

MS. LIM. Hindi po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, pumunta ka sa guwardya, ano ang sinabi mo sa guwardya?

MS. LIM. Sinabi ko po pupunta po ako kay Malou, iyong sekretarya ni Presidente Estrada, sabi ko po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O, ano naman ang sabi ng guwardya sa iyo?

MS. LIM. Wala naman po. Hindi naman po sila mahigpit. Pinapasok naman po ako.

MR. MENDOZA. A, ganoon lang? Sabi niya noong sinabi mong kay Malou, pupunta ka kay Presidente, sinabi sa iyo, okay lang, pumasok ka na?

MS. LIM. Iyong ano po, iyong usual na ginagawa po ng guwardya, hingan ka po ng I.D. Hinihingian po ako ng I.D. Iyon, nag iwan po ako ng I.D., Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Nag iwan. Pagkatapos noon, pinapasok ka na?

MS. LIM. Pinapas Bale ano po, bale dalawang guwardya po ang dinaanan ko, Your Honor, iyong guwardya sa pagpasok po doon sa compound, saka iyong guwardya ho pagpasok doon sa bahay.

MR. MENDOZA. Naglakad ka lang?

MS. LIM. Naglakad lang po ako, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Dumating ka roon sa bahay, marami bang tao? Mga ano’ng oras iyon? Hindi mo ba matatandaan?

MS. LIM. After lunch na po iyon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ha?

MS. LIM. After lunch na po.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo nga, after lunch. Alam mo naman ang after lunch, matagal, eh. Pero hindi mo ba makakalkula kung alas dos, alas tres o alas sinco?

MS. LIM. Hindi po aabot ng ano po, ng alas tres, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi aabot ng alas tres?

MS. LIM. Opo.

MR. MENDOZA. Marami pa bang tao roon?

MS. LIM. Hindi naman po masyado, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroong ilan?

MS. LIM. Ang matatandaan ko lang po, iyong pagpasok ko may kausap po si Presidente isang tao, bale dalawa po silang nag uusap; tapos, doon sa kuwan iyong kay Malou, may mga kasamahan din po siya doon na staff po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, marami ring tao roon, ano?

MS. LIM. Hindi po madami noong time na iyon.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroong ilan?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po basta hindi ko po matandaan, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, dire diretso ka na kay Malou?

MS. LIM. Noong ano po, pagdating na naman po doon sa ‘di dumaan muna po ako sa guwardya iyong pagpasok sa compound, pagdating naman po doon sa tapat na po ng bahay, may guwardya na naman po doon.

MR. MENDOZA. O.

MS. LIM. Iyon.

MR. MENDOZA. Pagkatapos, ano ang sinabi mo sa guwardya?

MS. LIM. Sinabi ko po na ano, iyong expected na ako ni Malou. Kaya iyon, pinapasok naman po ako.

MR. MENDOZA. Pinapasok ka na?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kaya tuloy tuloy ka na kay Malou?

MS. LIM. Tuloy tuloy na po kasi sinalubong naman na po ako, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ni Malou?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero noon mo pa lamang nakilala si Malou?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. O. Ibinigay mo na kaagad sa kanya?

MS. LIM. Inabot ko po iyong bag, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroon bang sala set na nakita mo pagpasok mo?

MS. LIM. Pagpasok po sa entrance po, dito po sa left side iyong nakita kong mga sala set, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero sa bandang kanan, walang sala set?

MS. LIM. Doon sa bandang kanan, wala po akong matatandaan

noong…

MR. MENDOZA. Na sala set? Ang nakita mong sala set, pagpasok

mo sa bandang kaliwa, may sala set?

MS. LIM. May sala set po doon.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero sa bandang kanan, walang sala set?

MS. LIM. Wala po akong matandaan.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, si Malou, dire diretso ka lang?

MS. LIM. Noong sinalubong po ako ni Malou po, iyon, sumunod na naman po ako sa kanya pagpasok sa ano.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid, sinalubong ka doon sa entrada pa lang, sinalubong ka na?

MS. LIM. Hindi ho, paglampas na po ‘di guwardya po ito, noong pinayagan na po akong pumasok ng guwardya po, iyon, sinalubong na po ako ni Malou. Tapos, pumasok na po kami doon sa office nila, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, basta’t iniwan mo na roon?

MS. LIM. Inabot ko na po iyong bag kay Malou, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ganoon na lang?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Tapos umalis ka na?

MS. LIM. Ano po nag usap po sila ni Gob., tapos kinausap din po niya ako?

MR. MENDOZA. Si Governor, nandoon?

MS. LIM. Wala po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. A, wala. Wala si Governor Singson noon? Samakatwid, ikaw lang ang kausap ni Malou?

MS. LIM. Ako ang kausap po niya, pero noong nandoon po ako, kinausap rin po niya si Governor Singson sa telepono, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. A, ganoon? Paano mong nalaman na si Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Kasi po narinig ko sabi niya, “Nandito na sila, Gob,” sabi po niya. Ibig sabihin, kausap niya si Gob. na sinasabi niya na nandoon na po kami.

MR. MENDOZA. Siya nga pala, kanina, noong Biyernes pala, noong nagdeklara ka, sinabi mo kumuha ka rin ng limang milyon, eh, doon sa kapatid ni Bong Pineda, natatandaan mo?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At nilagay naman ‘yon sa Ferragamo bag?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong bang bag na ‘yon kasing laki nito o mas malaki rito….

MS. LIM. Hindi..

MR. MENDOZA… o mas maliit dito sa ginamit dito sa pagpunta sa Malacañang?

MS. LIM. Ano lang po ‘yon papel lang po ‘yon, paper bag lang po na ‘yong shopping bag na Ferragamo, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, samakatuwid ‘yong sa kay Bong Pineda, paper bag lang ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano naman ang handle?

MS. LIM. Ano po ‘yong ano rin po, ‘yong parang natirintas din po na tali, ‘yong ginagamit po na shopping bag. Bale shopping bag po ‘yon na pag bumili ka sa Ferragamo, ‘yon po ang ginagamit po nila.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Parang papel lang ‘yon ano, papel lang ano?

MS. LIM. Ano po makapal po na hindi naman po makapal. Hindi ko po ano kung karton po ‘yon basta ano po, makapal siya sa papel mas makapal po siya dito po.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo.

MS. LIM. Dito po pero hindi naman…

MR. MENDOZA. Referring to the cardboard in the….

MS. LIM. Mas makapal po siya dito pero hindi naman po siya kasing kapal ng mga karton na sobrang kapal.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, eh ano naman ang handle noong Ferragamo bag na ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Iyong ano po natirintas na ‘yong mga natirintas po na… Kung gusto ‘nyo po dalhin ko dito, naitago ko po ‘yon.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Alam ko na ‘yong shopping bag, ang binibili sa Ferragamo, hindi ba madalas na bag?

REP. BATERINA. Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, what is the pleasure of counsel for the prosecution?

REP. BATERINA. Yes. May we request that the witness next time when she comes over, brings that Ferragamo bag.

MR. MENDOZA. I think, probably, that should be made when he goes on the counsel goes on redirect, Your Honor.

REP. BATERINA. Yes, but I’m just asking that I put it on record.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The proper time, maybe for redirect. The witness is only talking to counsel for the defense.

REP. BATERINA. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

MR. MENDOZA. As far as I am concerned, I think everybody knows what a Ferragamo bag is and what it usually and what you shop in Ferragamo usually shoes. Hindi ba Ferragamo alam mo madalas doon binibili natin bag ano, ‘yong ladies bags, sapatos, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo. Magagaan lang naman ‘yon, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Ang alin po?

MR. MENDOZA. Ang madalas na binibili sa Ferragamo.

MS. LIM. Depende po kung madami kayong bibilhin, mga ganoon po.

MR. MENDOZA. Ikaw ba ay nakapag shopping na sa Ferragamo?

MS. LIM. Hindi pa po.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, hindi pa. Oo. Eh, ‘yong pera naman basta nandodoon na lang sa bag, ‘yong pera nasa loob lang ng bag, ganoon lang?

MS. LIM. Iyong sa bag na Ferragamo?

MR. MENDOZA. Kay galing doon sa kapatid ni Bong Pineda.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi mo na binilang?

MS. LIM. Binandel (bundle) count ko po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Bundle count uli at bawat bundle isang milyon uli?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mukha ‘yong mga nagbibigay ng pera pare pareho ang bundle ano, palaging tig one million ano?

MS. LIM. Ewan ko po sa kanila, ‘yon naman po ang binibigay nila, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroon kay Bong Pineda, kay Jinggoy Estrada, doon sa dinala mong mga ‘yan, bundle din puro one million, ganoon ano pare pareho?

MS. LIM. Hindi naman po pare pareho ‘yong ano po ‘yong basta’t pag nag bundle po sila, isang milyon, isang bundle.

MR. MENDOZA. Sabi mo doon sa LCS Building mayroong vault naka assign sa iyo, ano ba ‘yong vault na sinasabi mo, vault ba?

MS. LIM. Bale ano po ‘yon filing cabinet po siya na doon sa pinakamataas niya ‘yong pinaka fourth layer po niya, vault po iyon, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Para sa iyong gamit lang ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Lahat kayo mayroong ganoon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Mayroon si Mrs. Itchon?

MS. LIM. Mayroon din po siya, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sino ba ang unang nagtrabaho sa inyo roon si Mrs. Itchon o ikaw?

MS. LIM. Ako po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ah, ikaw. Kailan ba nag umpisa si Mrs. Itchon doon?

MS. LIM. February 1999, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. February 1999. Sandali lang ha. Ikaw ba’y gumawa na ng affidavit na ibinigay doon sa Blue Ribbon?

MS. LIM. Wala po akong ibinibigay pa sa Blue Ribbon, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. No more cross examination…\emsm.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. No more cross examination, questions?

MR. MENDOZA. Just one…. I am just trying to see whether I may conclude now, Your Honor.

Sandali na lang. Huwag kang maiinip.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may now proceed.

MR. MENDOZA. With the permission of the….

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Granted.

MR. MENDOZA. ‘Yan bang lahat na sinabi mong ginawa mo, ginawa mo dahil inutos sa iyo ni Govenor Singson, ano?

MS. LIM. Ang alin po?

REP. BATERINA. Vague, Your Honor. Vague.

MR. MENDOZA. Ang lahat ng ginawa mo: pagkuha ng pera, sumama sa…dito sa pagtetistigo mo. O, sa isahin ko ba?

REP. BATERINA. Cannot lump up into one question…

MR. MENDOZA. Pardon please….

REP. BATERINA….all the things that she testified, Your Honor. So, I object…

MR. MENDOZA. All right, I will….

REP. BATERINA….on the ground that the question is vague.

MR. MENDOZA. I thought I need not enumerate because I was referring only to everything that she said she did in her testimony.

Pagkuha mo ng pera kay Mayor Estrada, sinabi mo, pagkuha mo ng…pagpunta mo ng Dusit Hotel, pagkuha mo ng pera doon sa kapatid ni Bong Pineda, pagdala mo ng pera doon sa bag doon sa Greenhills, ‘yong lahat na sinabi mong sa pagde deklara mo na ginawa mo tungkol sa pagkukuha ng pera na sinasabi mo ay galing sa jueteng eh ginawa mo ‘yan dahil inutos sa iyo ni Governor Singson, hindi ba?

REP. BATERINA. Misleading.

MR. MENDOZA. What misleading?

REP. BATERINA. Misleading because it does not distinguish between the act and the statement of the Governor.

MR. MENDOZA. All right, I will do it one by one.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The objection is sustained.

You started with an enumeration but you ended up with a general statement.

So, it is partly misleading.

MR. MENDOZA. So, I will reform.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Make another question.

MR. MENDOZA. Isa isahin natin itong deklarasyon mo: Sinabi mo pumunta ka kay Mayor Estrada noong January 2000.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kumuha ka ng isang milyon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Dahil pinapunta ka roon ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Kung hindi ka inutos ni Governor Singson, ‘di ka naman pupunta roon, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Siyempre naman po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oh, kanya, samakatuwid, pumunta ka dahil inutusan ka?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ayon. Noong February 2000, sinabi mo pumunta ka uli kay Mayor Estrada, kumuha ka ng isang milyon, natatandaan mo?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pumunta ka doon sapagkat inutusan ka ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ikaw kasi empleyado, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Siyanga pala, maliban sa pagkukuha ng mga perang ito, ano pa ba ang trabaho mo roon sa…na ginagawa mo para kay Governor Singson? Wala ka pang nabanggit na iba.

MS. LIM. Ano po, ako rin po ang in-charge dito sa Manila ‘yong mga taga Ilocos Sur po na may problema; mga overseas contract workers po na may problema. Kagaya po ‘yong iba, napapauwi po o kaya ang mga iba na-fake. Basta lahat po ng problema ng mga overseas contract workers na taga Ilocos Sur, pagkailangan dito sa Manila po ayusin, ako po ang tumutulong na nag a assist.

MR. MENDOZA. Ikaw ang nag aasikaso.

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pangatlo, noong sinabi mo eh March 17, 2000, pumunta ka doon sa kay Mayor Estrada uli, kumuha ka naman ng tseke, totoo ba ‘yon?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po ini expect na tseke po ang ibigay niya noon.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo nga, pero tinatanong ko lang sa iyo kung tseke ba ‘yong kinuha mo noon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero ito, natatandaan mo, March 17, 2000?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At ‘yong tsekeng ‘yon, tiningnan mo’ng mabuti?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At sinabi mo iyong tsekeng iyon bangko sa United Overseas Bank of the Philippines?

MS. LIM. Hindi po. United Overseas Bank Philippines, San Juan Branch, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ano?

MS. LIM. United Overseas Bank Philippines, San Juan Branch.

MR. MENDOZA. San Juan Branch. Samakatuwid iyong bangko, United Overseas Bank Philippines, pero iyon branch sa San Juan?

MS. LIM. Sa San Juan po.

MR. MENDOZA. Sigurado ka roon?

MS. LIM. Sigurado po ako, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At sigurado ka mayroong litrato doon si Mayor Estrada?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. One million iyong tsekeng iyon?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Natitiyak mo iyon, ha?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. At dineposito mo iyon?

MS. LIM. Dineposito ko po sa account ni Governor Singson, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Good iyong tseke?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Natitiyak mo iyon, ha? Okay. Pero mukhang ito lang ang nasisiguro mong mayroong petsang araw, March 17, sapagkat iyong una, January, February, hindi mo masiguro ang petsa, ano?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, iyon pumunta ka rin doon dahil inutusan ka ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, noon namang pagpunta mo doon sa No. 2 Albany, Northeast Greenhills sa bahay ni Bong Pineda, February 2000, tama ba iyon?

MS. LIM. Iyon po iyong pangalawang punta ko, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ilang beses ka bang pumunta roon?

MS. LIM. Dalawa po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Sa dalawang pagkakataon kumuha ka ng pera?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong una, anong petsa?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan basta January 2000 din po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi mo rin matandaan?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Anong pero January?

MS. LIM. January 2000 po.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyong petsa hindi mo matandaan?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan, pero puwedeng middle of January o kaya end of January po, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero February, hindi mo rin matandaan ang petsa?

MS. LIM. Hindi ko po matandaan, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero sa dalawang pagkakataon na pagpunta mo roon, dahil inutusan ka rin ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Ngayon, doon din sa pagpupunta mo sa Dusit Hotel, para kumuha ng tumanggap ng anuman kay Mr. Prieto, dahil inutusan ka rin ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Pagpunta lang po, kasi minsan lang po ako pumunta, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Oo, iyon nga. Pumunta ka roon dahil inutusan ka ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Iyon nga ang aking tinatanong lang sana na kung sa lahat na pagkakataon na nabanggit ko ginawa mo lahat iyan sapagkat inutusan ka ni Governor Singson.

Ngayon…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What’s the answer of the witness?

MR. MENDOZA. Ano daw?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Or that’s only a conclusion?

REP. BATERINA. There was an observation, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Only an observation.

REP. BATERINA. But there was no question that was propounded by the…

MR. MENDOZA. No question.

Iyon bang jueteng eh alam mo, di ba alam mong illegal iyan?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Di iyong pagko kolekta sa jueteng labag iyan sa batas?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Di iyong tumutulong sa pagko kolekta na nanggagaling sa jueteng di gumagawa ng kalabagan sa batas, hindi ba?

MS. LIM. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi ka ba medyo kinabahan na ginawa mo iyon?

MS. LIM. Kinabahan po ako pero sino ba naman po ako para kasi kay Presidente naman po iyang jueteng, sino naman po ako para ano po.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The…

MR. MENDOZA. Hindi ka kinabahan dahil sabi ni Governor Singson, “Para kay Presidente iyan, ano?”

MS. LIM. Opo.

MR. MENDOZA. Samakatuwid ang nag utos sa iyo si Governor Singson at naging komportable kang sumunod sa kanya maski na illegal sapagkat sabi ni Governor Singson, “Para kay Presidente iyan, ano?”

MS. LIM. Opo.

MR. MENDOZA. Pero kung hindi sinabi para kay Presidente iyan, di ba gagawin mo rin sapagkat utos ni Governor Singson?

MS. LIM. Gagawin ko rin po kasi…

MR. MENDOZA. O, iyon, gagawin mo rin.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Nothing further for cross examination?

MR. MENDOZA. … I have no more questions, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Thank you. Redirect?

REP. BATERINA. May I ask that we call a one minute recess, Your Honors?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. For redirect?

REP. BATERINA. To find out what my colleagues in the prosecution can tell me, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. One minute without suspending the trial.

REP. BATERINA. Without suspending the…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You can just talk among yourselves.

REP. BATERINA. Without asking the witness to step down, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, because it’s very difficult to call back again to the trial for a resumption.

REP. BATERINA. Thank you.

We are ready, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What’s the pleasure of Prosecutor Baterina? Any redirect?

REP. BATERINA. Yes, we are unanimous of the prosecution panel that we do not have any redirect questions, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Thank you. The witness is now excused.

Next witness.

REP. APOSTOL. We are ready, Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors, for our next witness, General Lastimoso.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Proceed, Prosecutor Apostol.

REP. APOSTOL. May we call General Lastimoso. The Honorable Roan Libarios will be the one handling the case, the witness.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Honorable Libarios will now continue the redirect. Redirect?

REP. LIBARIOS. Your Honor please, during the last hearing the recross examination was deferred because the counsel for the defense requested for a copy of the annexes of the memorandum and the directive.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So, this is continuation of the cross examination?

REP. LIBARIOS. Recross, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Recross already.

REP. LIBARIOS. We have finished already, Your Honor, our redirect.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Redirect. So, this is now recross, counsel for the defense for recross.

MR. Fortun.

MR. FORTUN. Mr. Chief Justice, I will be conducting recross.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed now.

MR. FORTUN. Thank you, Your Honor.

Just a few administrative matters before I commence my recross, Your Honor, the reason being I was instructed by the Honorable Senator-Judge Roco to produce Annexes C and D.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Are you ready with the annexes?

MR. FORTUN. Yes, Your Honor, I am.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Have you distributed copies of these to the Honorable Senators-Judges?

MR. FORTUN. I am going to do that right now, Your Honor. These are certified machine copies of Annexes C and D and I would like to inform the Honorable Senator-Judges that reference to Annexes A and B as indicated in the memoranda which had been previously marked as Exhibit “3” refer actually to Exhibits “2” and “4”. So, Annexes A and B referred to in this particular exhibit pertain to Exhibits “2” and “4”.

May I ask the Secretary of the Senate to assist in the distribution of…

May I proceed, Your Honor?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. For a little while, after the distribution of the annexes. Kindly provide the Senate President and the Presiding Officer with copies of the documents.

You may now proceed, MR. Fortun.

MR. FORTUN. May we ask that the annex not be given to the witness because I will be propounding certain questions to him prior to the submission of the annex.

I distinctly remember that I had requested that the copy be furnished the Honorable Senator-Judges and not to the witness.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

MR. Fortun…

MR. FORTUN. May I be allowed to question…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. …you have more questions for re-cross?

MR. FORTUN. Yes, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed now.

MR. FORTUN. Thank you, Your Honor.

General Lastimoso, the first time that you appeared before this Honorable Tribunal was last Thursday and your testimony was suspended and subsequently reset to Friday. Today is a Monday, sir, and this is therefore the third time that you are appearing before this Honorable Tribunal. I would assume, sir, that you have time to reflect and mull over the matters which you had previously disclosed to this Body, principal among which was your statement upon redirect exam of the prosecutor that you had actually talked to the President — this discussion in Malacanang where you said that Governor Chavit Singson was also there — was after you had issued the two memorandums which we had previously marked as Exhibits “2” and “4.” Do you remember having said all of these things, sir?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Yes, sir, I did.

MR. FORTUN. And I distinctly remember, sir, that in the first testimony that you had given before this tribunal you had indicated that you had assumed office as Acting Chief, PNP in July of 1998. That is correct again, sir, is it not?

MR. LASTIMOSO. That’s correct.

MR. FORTUN. And the discussion which you had with Governor Singson, according to you, and President Estrada took place a few months after you took over as Acting Chief, PNP in July of 1998. Is that right, sir?

MR. LASTIMOSO. That’s right.

MR. FORTUN. So, the question that I ask you now on recross is, will you tell us, General Lastimoso, on what particular month was it that this meeting between you, the President and Mr. Singson took place?

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Excuse me, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, the Senate President.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Mr. Fortun, it would do our country well and our people to know that the title of Mr. Lastimoso is Police Director General, not General. Because general is a military rank and we get confusing the military rank with police officer’s rank. I think we should put the record straight.

MR. FORTUN. Mr. President, my recollection, in fact, is that his last highest rank is Police Deputy Director General.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Yes.

MR. FORTUN. And I think Deputy Director General Lastimoso will confirm this, sir?

MR. LASTIMOSO. I will confirm that, Your Honor.

MR. FORTUN. Yes.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. My point is, please do not address him only as “General.”

MR. FORTUN. Very well. I will comply, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Meaning the correct designation of his office at the time.

MR. FORTUN. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

So, Mr. Deputy Director General Lastimoso, could you tell us now what particular month it was that you actually had met with Mr. Singson, President Joseph Estrada in Malacanang?

MR. LASTIMOSO. I testified it before that I cannot exactly remember the month. But I’m very sure it was very much later after I took over.

MR. FORTUN. Very much later. Would you say that it was in the month of September of 1998?

MR. LASTIMOSO. It could be, it could be. My only basis there is the fact that we were called in the presidential residence, we call that PR or the Guest House, and as far as my recollection is concerned, the President moved to that place a little or very much later in 1998.

MR. FORTUN. I see. So, even before the presidential residence or the Guest House was completed, you had met in that particular place?

MR. LASTIMOSO. No, I said I met him in the Polk at Polk Street, in his residence, Greenhills.

MR. FORTUN. Oh, are you saying now, Police Director Deputy Director General Lastimoso, that your meeting with President Estrada and Mr. Singson was not at the Guest House of Malacañang, but was at Polk Street? Is that what you’re saying, sir?

MR. LASTIMOSO. No, it was at the Guest House, that’s why I said I cannot be wrong when I say that I met him with Governor Singson very much later because we were called at the Guest House.

MR. FORTUN. I see. So, the Guest House, according to you, was the venue of this particular meeting and the Guest House was already completely renovated at that time, sir?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Well, I would assume that it has been completely renovated because we were received in the office at the Guest House.

MR. FORTUN. I see. All right then. You can’t say that it was in September of 1998. Was it perhaps in October of 1998?

MR. LASTIMOSO. It could be.

MR. FORTUN. What about in November of 1998?

MR. LASTIMOSO. It could be also.

MR. FORTUN. Could be. How about in Decem November of 1998?

MR. LASTIMOSO. I ’98? Yes, it could be in November.

MR. FORTUN. December 1998 perhaps?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Could be also.

MR. FORTUN. I see. And are you aware, sir, that even during all of these period, where you say that the President allegedly instructed you to coordinate with Mr. Singson on the matter of jueteng, you had continued to issue orders to stop precisely the proliferation of jueteng all over the country? You remember having issued orders to that effect in the month of September,

in the month of October, in the month of November, in the month of December of 1998 and even in the year 1999, January? You would recall having issued those orders …

MR. LASTIMOSO. I cannot …

MR. FORTUN. … precisely in contravention of what you now claim as an instruction by the President that you coordinate with Governor Singson on jueteng?

MR. LASTIMOSO. I cannot exactly recall if I have issued these directives, but I could have issued these directives.

MR. FORTUN. You could have.

MR. LASTIMOSO. It could be in any of these months.\

MR. FORTUN. I see. I will now show you those directives, sir. Perhaps your memory will be refreshed and perhaps you will now be able to think back and determine whether there was actually that instruction by the President because your memorandas always refer back to the President as having directed you to stop jueteng.

Let me start with a memoranda issued by you, sir memorandum issued by you on September 14, 1998, addressed again this time similar to your Exhibit “2″ I’m sorry, Exhibit “4,” where you had directed regional directors and everybody under you to stop illegal gambling, particularly jueteng. I show you a memorandum dated September 14, 1998 with a subject, “Continuing Conduct of Illegal Gambling All Over the Country” and this, in fact, states that the reference of this instruction emanated from President Joseph E. Estrada to you as Acting Chief of the PNP.

Will you tell us, sir, whether this is one of the memorandum you had issued on the matter?

MR. LASTIMOSO. I can only confirm here my signature. I’m sure this is my signature.

MR. FORTUN. We request, Your Honor, that this memorandum dated September 14, 1998 be marked as our Exhibit “5″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Mark it.

MR. FORTUN. I show you too a letter which was ostensibly written by you, signed by you, sir, bearing, in fact, your bar code or the bar code of your office, Chief PNP, letter 1998, addressed to President Estrada. And here, you were most confident in saying that you have stopped the resurgence of illegal gambling, particularly jueteng and masiao, appearing in the last line of paragraph 2, where you say, Police Deputy Director General Lastimoso that this was a letter which you had sent President Estrada on September 18 of 1999?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Again, I will confirm my signature and I could have wrote this letter?

MR. FORTUN. We request, Your Honor, that the letter of September 18, 1998 signed by Roberto T. Lastimoso, Acting Chief, PNP on the matter of his eradication of jueteng and masiao be marked as our Exhibit “6″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let it be so marked. You are referring to this letter addressed to the President through the Honorable Acting Chairman Ronaldo B. Puno?

MR. FORTUN. That is correct, Mr. Chief Justice.

In November of 1998, sir, you in fact issued a Letter of Instruction which you code named “Rolette”, and I am showing you the document, sir. It consists of four pages. And in the last paragraph of Page 1, sir, I’d like to read it with you. It says:

“Aware of the resurgence/proliferation of illegal gambling, President Joseph E. Estrada, through Usec Ronaldo Puno of DILG, issued an order to stop all forms of illegal gambling, particularly jueteng and masiao, nationwide.”

And this goes forward, sir, in identifying all the line officers under you, from the provincial, district officers or the PROs or the Special Action Force of the PNP, the Inspector General, the CIDG, the IAO or the Investigation Office of the PNP, the Directorate for Operations, the Directorate for Intelligence, the DIDM and even your Community and Relations Service or your Public Information Office, giving specific instructions on the matter of eradicating illegal gambling, particularly jueteng and masiao, nationwide.

There is again a signature at the last page, sir, of this particular letter of instruction, will you please take a look at it, sir, and tell us whether this is your signature as well?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Yes, I can confirm this signature. That is mine.

MR. FORTUN. Considering that this is a letter of instruction which ostensibly emanated from your office, will you now state categorically that this particular document was in fact made by you? Was this made by you, sir?

MR. LASTIMOSO. This was prepared by my staff which I signed.

MR. FORTUN. I see. Which you signed. You, therefore, confirmed that there was in fact a Letter of Instruction 43 98 which you even code named “Rolette” emanating from your office?

MR. LASTIMOSO. I can confirm this document.

MR. FORTUN. Thank you, sir. We request, Your Honor, that this document consisting of four pages be marked as our Exhibit “7″, “7 A” through “7 C”.

We further request, Your Honor, that the exhibits which …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let the document be marked as Exhibit “7″, and the succeeding pages from second page, the third, the fourth, and the fifth, be marked respectively as Exhibit “7 A”, “7 B”, “7 C”, “7 D”, “7 E”. Is that correct? Okay, up to “7 D”.

MR. FORTUN. “7 D”, I apologize, Mr. Chief Justice.

For purposes of identification, as well, Mr. Chief Justice, may I be allowed to submark the signatures of Police Deputy Director General Lastimoso appearing in Exhibits “5″ and “6″ as Exhibits “5 A” and “6 A”.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “5 A” and “6 A”?

MR. FORTUN. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice, “5 A” and “6 A” to be bracketed and marked …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let that be so marked. So “5 A” is the signature of the witness on this memorandum of 14 September 1998 already marked as Exhibit “5″?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER Exhibit “5”?

MR. FORTUN. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “6-A” is the signature of the witness on the letter dated September 18, marked as Exhibit “6”.

MR. FORTUN. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Go ahead.

MR. FORTUN. And the signature of Police Deputy Director General Lastimoso appearing in Exhibit “7-E”. Seven Echo.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “7-B”?

MR. FORTUN. No, Your Honor, “7-E” be bracketed and submarked as “7-E-1”.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Mark it.

MR. FORTUN. May I proceed, Mr. Chief Justice?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Proceed.

MR. FORTUN. Do you recall,Police Deputy Director General Lastimoso of a letter which you had personally signed dated January 7 of 1999, addressed to Deputy Speaker Alfredo Abueg, where you specifically refer to LOI 4398, which is Exhibit “7”, in order to suppress and completely put to stop jueteng and other forms of illegal gambling operations particularly in Palawan province? Do you remember having issued this letter, sir?

REP. LIBARIOS. Your Honor please, I would like to register our objection to this line of questioning. These matters were not taken up during the recross and the redirect examination, Your Honor. So, it would be improper, Your Honor, because this was not part of the coverage of the redirect.

Under the Rules, Your Honor, the recross should only be limited to the concerns or the subject matter raised during the redirect examination, Your Honor. So we feel that the coverage now is already improper.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You are objecting to the last question?

REP. LIBARIOS. Yes, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What’s your answer, Mr. Fortun?

MR. FORTUN. The premise of all this question was precisely on the matter of whether or not there were issuances made by him after the first one which he said took place prior to his conversation with President Estrada and Governor Singson.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So only in relation to that.

MR. FORTUN. Yes, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. It is really in the nature of a recross on an issue which you have taken up on redirect?

MR. FORTUN. That is precisely the case, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Only for that purpose?

MR. FORTUN. And what appears now as a fact is that, there were additional issuances which were made even after he had spoken with both President Estrada and Governor Singson.

REP. LIBARIOS. May I be allowed to make additional manifestation, Your Honor? Your Honor please, these matters are actually new matters and it would be unfair for the prosecution to be – for the witness to be examined on these new matters, Your Honor, which were not given during the cross-examination, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. It was stated that the purpose was purely to rebut the answer on redirect examination.

REP. LIBARIOS. The problem now, Your Honor…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. However, if you really believe that this would be treated as entirely a new matter, you can probably ask for an additional redirect at a proper time.

REP. LIBARIOS. Thank you, Your Honor.

MR. FORTUN. May I be allowed to proceed, Mr. Chief Justice?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Proceed.

MR. FORTUN. May I know your answer Deputy Director General Lastimoso in respect of the January 7, 1999 letter in front of you?

MR. LASTIMOSO. What is the question again, sir?

MR. FORTUN. The question, sir, is whether or not this particular – do you remember having issued and signed this particular letter in front of you dated January 7 of 1999?

MR. LASTIMOSO. I can also acknowledge this signature as mine.

MR. FORTUN. Request, Your Honor, that this document be marked as Exhibit “9”.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Eight.

MR. FORTUN. I’m sorry, “8”.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let it be so marked.

MR. FORTUN. And the signature of the witness bracketed and marked as our Exhibit “8-A”.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let it be so marked as Exhibit “8-A”. Nothing further?

MR. FORTUN. Perhaps a final point for the Deputy Director General, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

MR. FORTUN. Will you tell us, Deputy Director General Lastimoso, during your incumbency from July of 1998 through January of year 2000, whether you had issued any order which revokes any of these orders or letters that you had issued, particularly Exhibit “4″, “5, “6″ and “7.”

MS. LASTIMOSO. Your Honor, may I correct the counsel. I was only the Acting Chief, PNP, up to May of 1999…

MR. FORTUN. As corrected.

MS. LASTIMOSO. … not January 2000.

MR. FORTUN. As corrected.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. As corrected.

MR. FORTUN. May we know your answer, sir?

MS. LASTIMOSO. I have not issued any official document or memoranda or directive that would revoke this order.

MR. FORTUN. I have nothing further for the witness, Your Honor.

Thank you, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Thank you, too.

The Honorable Senator Judge Roco before we will recognize Prosecutor Libarios.

SEN. ROCO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice. I did reserve to ask questions after I received the annexes. Can we just ask Mr. Lastimoso to look at Exhibit “3″ …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Exhibit “6.”

SEN. ROCO. Three, three.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Three.

Kindly furnish the witness with Exhibit “3”…

SEN. ROCO. Yes.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. …MR. Fortun.

MR. FORTUN. Yes, sir.

SEN. ROCO. Yes, the lull should not be taken against my two minutes. But somebody should give him Exhibit “3.”

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The waiting period is deducted from the two minutes.

SEN. ROCO. Yes, thank you.

The Exhibit “3″ is the July 27, 1998, by the Acting Chief, PNP, Director for Operations, signed by Miguel Coronel. Yes.

MR. FORTUN. Senator Judge Roco, I’m providing the witness a copy.

SEN. ROCO. Thank you, thank you.

At the bottom of the page, there is a bar code if you will look at the bar code, OCPNP in DOC 98PO27857 and it’s a bar code. Can you tell us what the bar code is? Is this meant to secure or to indicate that this is a genuine order from the PNP?

MS. LASTIMOSO. That is correct, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. That is correct. Can you now look at Exhibit “5.” Maybe you go back to the Annex “D”, the Epimaco Velasco letter. There is also a bar code and this is meant to indicate the genuineness of this

document, correct?

MS. LASTIMOSO. I do not have a copy of that exhibit, Your Honor. Can I please be given?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. MR. Fortun, show the witness the exhibit in question.

MR. FORTUN. Is Senator Judge Roco referring to Exhibit “D,” Your Honor?

SEN. ROCO. Annex “D” of Exhibit “3,” the one signed by Epimaco Velasco. Secretary, you just gave it to me today.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. That is dated 19 March 1998.

SEN. ROCO. Yes. This is the basis of, apparently, the memoranda of Mr. Lastimoso.

MR. FORTUN. It is with Police Director, Deputy Director General Lastimoso.

SEN. ROCO. Yes.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So, what is the answer now of the witness?

SEN. ROCO. There is a bar code to secure these documents to indicate that it’s a genuine document.

MR. LASTIMOSO. Your Honor, this particular document is dated 19 March 1998.

SEN. ROCO. Yes, before your time.

MR. LASTIMOSO. This is not during my time, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. No, no, no, I know. But the bar code

indicates security and the genuineness of this particular …

MR. LASTIMOSO. Yes, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. Yes. And as a matter of fact, in all the genuine documents, Exhibit “5,” there is a bar code; Exhibit “6,” there is a bar code; and Exhibit “8″ there is a bar code to indicate genuineness of these documents, correct?

MS. LASTIMOSO. Yes, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. But Exhibit “2″ and Exhibit “7″ do not have a bar code. Does it mean that these are not genuine and they were invented by you?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Can I have the … Your Honor, I do not have a copy of this…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Show the witness Exhibit “7″ up to “7 E”…

SEN. ROCO. All the exhibits have a bar code, except for Exhibit “2″ dated July 31 ’98 which has no bar code. It’s signed by Lastimoso. And Exhibit “7″ which has been produced only now which also has no bar code.

Does it mean that these two particular exhibits are not genuine and are not authenticated as genuine documents of PNP?

MR. LASTIMOSO. It could be, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. It could be.

MR. LASTIMOSO. It could be, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. Very good. Now, just as another badge of fraud, this Exhibit “2″, July 31, ’98, under your signature, refers to ah, no, the signature of Mr. Lastimoso refers to July 4 and July 20 instructions of President Estrada, but the documents speak of the documents basing or referring to orders under President Ramos still, is this correct? And the document can speak for itself.

MR. LASTIMOSO. Is this Exhibit “2,” Your Honor?

SEN. ROCO. Exhibit “2″ does not have a bar code, and as you have admitted this may therefore not be authentic and this may be just a spurious document.

MR. LASTIMOSO. Your Honor, the references here refer to …

SEN. ROCO. July 4.

MR. LASTIMOSO. A memorandum of July 4 of 1998 …

SEN. ROCO. Yes.

MR. LASTIMOSO. … about the Anti Criminality Campaign, and the verbal instruction of His Excellency, President Estrada, on July 20.

SEN. ROCO. Yeah, I’m through with my two minutes. I’ll be happy with the original answer that Exhibit “2″ and Exhibit “7″ could therefore be not authenticated and not genuine documents from the PNP.

MR. LASTIMOSO. It could be, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. Yeah, thank you.

MR. FORTUN. Ah, may I just make a manifestation, Mr. Chief Justice, please?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. As a consequence of what?

MR. FORTUN. As a consequence of the observation and questions propounded by the Honorable Senator Judge Roco.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may.

MR. FORTUN. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

The two exhibits which I had presented to Police Deputy Director General Lastimoso, identified as Exhibits “2″ and “7,” though without a bar code are certified machine copies made by a certain Police Superintendent Asprinio Cabula, Administrative Officer, of the Office of the Chief of the Philippine National Police.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The manifestation is noted.

MR. FORTUN. Thank you, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. We will hear now Prosecutor, Honorable Libarios.

REP. LIBARIOS. Thank you, Your Honor. I will just limit my additional redirect, Your Honor, to the new matter …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Just for the record and for an orderly proceeding, would you kindly request for permission to ask additional questions?

REP. LIBARIOS. I’m going into that, Your Honor.

THE MAJORITY LEADER. Mr. Chief Justice.

REP. LIBARIOS. May I be allowed, Your Honor, to …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, with your permission, Honorable Libarios, may we recognize the Majority Leader.

THE MAJORITY LEADER. Mr. Chief Justice, pursuant to our agreement, it’s now 5:45, I move for a 15 minute break.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Thank you for reminding the Court. In the meantime, we suspend the trial for 15 minutes.

THE TRIAL WAS SUSPENDED AT 5:46 P.M.

THE TRIAL WAS RESUMED AT 6:00 P.M.

THE SERGEANT-AT-ARMS. Please all rise.

The Chief Justice, the Honorable Hilario G. Davide, Jr. and the Senate President, the Honorable Aquilino Q. Pimentel, Jr.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Trial is resumed.

The Honorable Libarios yes, for a while, may we have to recognize the Honorable Senator Judge Guingona.

SEN. GUINGONA. Yes. Your Honor please, may we ask Deputy Director General Lastimoso.

During the direct and the cross, you stated that the instruction to you was, “Tulungan mo at mag coordinate kayong dalawa.” Is that correct?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Ang kumpleto pong sinabi, Your Honor, ipinakilala po sa akin si Governor at ang sabi itong si Governor Singson ay siya ngayon ang mamamahala ng jueteng. At ang sabi po niya, “Tulungan mo siya at mag coordinate kayong dalawa.” Iyon po ang kumpletong statement.

SEN. GUINGONA. Yes. Did you implement that directive?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Iyon nga po iyong sinabi ko dito because I could not implement it officially, hindi ho magandang i implement iyan officially, I told Governor Singson to coordinate with the local officials and the local police commanders at doon na lang po sila mag usap.

SEN. GUINGONA. So how was that directive implemented?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Tacitly, Your Honor. Wala na po kaming ginawa na operation kasi po itong mga sinasabing memorandum, ito po’y panangga ito sa Presidente. We are trying to insulate him because we received a lot of flak from civic sectors, from the church about the proliferation of jueteng. And naturally, we have to make it appear na mayroon kaming operation. Pero iba po iyong nandidito at iba po iyong instruction sa akin na verbal.

SEN. GUINGONA. Thank you.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. No further question.

Now, Honorable Libarios.

REP. LIBARIOS. Your Honors, after conferring with the members of the panel of the prosecution, it was agreed, Your Honor, unanimously that we waive all additional redirect examination and we are now ….

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Additional redirect is waived. And we recognize the Honorable Senator-Judge Coseteng.

SEN. COSETENG. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed, Your Honor.

SEN. COSETENG. I just would like to ask Police Director General a few questions to explain his August 3 document which was signed by him as he had presented to this court. And I would like to find out if he has a copy with him right now.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

MR. LASTIMOSO. I have, Your Honor, a copy of the several documents that were presented here.

SEN. COSETENG. Yes. Do you confirm, Mr. Lastimoso, that you conducted 106 operations between July 1st and the 28th of 1998?

REP. LIBARIOS. Your Honor please.

MR. LASTIMOSO. Your Honor, excuse me, I don’t…. May I….

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The witness is…. There is a pending question by a member of the Impeachment Court. And….

REP. LIBARIOS. A matter of procedure, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What is the matter of procedure?

REP. LIBARIOS. It appears that the witness has not been furnished a copy of the alleged document, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Then, he can make the proper answer. But please do not interrupt when a member of the Impeachment Court is asking the question.

REP. LIBARIOS. I’m sorry, Your Honor.

SEN. COSETENG. Mr. Chief Justice, this document was submitted to the court, and it looks like it’s the 8th of December.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Was it marked already in evidence?

SEN. COSETENG. Yes. But the markings are rather faint. One says, it’s Exhibit “4”, and another marking says, it’s Exhibit “E”. So, I don’t know which of these two markings prevail.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Since these are defense exhibits, would the defense try to help the proper identification of the document subject of the question?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Your Honor. Your Honor, I think I can remember that. That particular document is my letter to the President….

SEN. COSETENG. Yes. That’s correct.

MR. LASTIMOSO. … informing him of our accomplishments from July… ah, the first week of July up to the last week of July insofar as jueteng operation is concerned, Your Honor.

SEN. COSETENG. Yes.

MR. LASTIMOSO. And the figure, Your Honor, is taken from the records, the reports of the field commanders. I think the figure is based on statistics.

SEN. COSETENG. Yes. Because just for the knowledge also of the court, it says, 1,006 operations were conducted with 807 arrested and P320,039.70 recovered. And I would like to ask Director General Lastimoso how he would explain these particular statistics when it would seem like it was only P317.00 per operations that was recovered, if you take the average of this. So, what kind of an operation exactly were you conducting, Director General?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Your Honor, I can only give you my opinion on that because whenever an operation is conducted, we will be catching only the cobradors, the cobradors who get the jueteng bets. And most often, the money in their possession is not really that big.

SEN. COSETENG. So, you have not actually caught any gambling lords? Out of these 1,006 operations in 28 days, you have not caught any of the gambling lords?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Well, Your Honor, the gambling lords that might have been caught there are the small ones, not really the gambling lords that are always mentioned as the big fish.

SEN. COSETENG. And you’re saying that this was the best that could be done by the police all over Luzon, because I assume this was operation conducted in the entire island of Luzon.

MR. LASTIMOSO. Your Honor, that is an operation conducted all over the country.

SEN. COSETENG. No other questions, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The distinguished Senator-Judge Miriam Defensor Santiago.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Mr. Witness, earlier, you responded to a question by saying, “’Yong mga memos na iyon, panangga lang namin iyan kay Pangulong Estrada at binabatikos na siya.” So, I presume, you mean to say that you engaged in the process of issuing these memos ostensibly for the prevention or the outright stopping of illegal jueteng in order to protect the President. Is that a fair recapitulation of your statement?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Your Honor, the operation basically is aimed at reinforcing our instructions because ang nangyayari po doon sa ibaba, para pong niñgas kugon iyan, eh. Pagka nag issue kami ngayon ng directive at mayroon pang kasamang pananakot ay mabilis po silang nag ooperate, after a while wala na pong nangyayari, eh. Kaya po ang binabatikos diyan iyong pulis. At ayaw po naming ipaabot sa Presidente na siya, na masabi na ang Presidente walang ginagawa. Iyan po ang ibig kong sabihin noon.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Ito ho bang mga memos na tinutukoy ninyo, ito ba’y pinirmahan at pinakalat ninyo pagkatapos na ng meeting ninyo sa Malacañang o habang nagmi meeting kayo, o bago kayo nag meeting?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Ito pong mga memos, all dated before that meeting in Malacañang except for this last memorandum na sinasabi ng defense na inisyu kahit wala namang bar code. Iyong all the others we have done were made before that alleged meeting that meeting rather.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Oh, is it your contention therefore, that all these memos against illegal jueteng were issued before your meeting with President Estrada?

MR. LASTIMOSO. In effect, Your Honor, all of these memos except the last one which was pointed out earlier na wala pong bar code, iyon po ay before ito, before that meeting.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Ibig mong sabihin, pagkatapos na inutusan kayo ni Pangulong Estrada, when he said in that scenario that you drew for us, when he said, “Ito na si Gobernador Singson ang mamamahala sa jueteng, mag coordinate kayo.” Ibig mong sabihin pagkatapos niyan, hindi ka na nag isyu ng memo laban sa illegal jueteng? Is that the position?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Wala na po akong natandaan, Your Honor, na inisyu ko.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Oh, in other words, you participated with your full knowledge and consent in an attempt to mislead the Filipino public about the state of the police campaign against illegal jueteng.

Is that what you’re saying?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Ah…

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Sinunod mo ang utos ni Pangulong Estrada?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Sinunod ko lang po ang utos ni Presidente.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Ah, kung hindi na pala nahinto ang illegal jueteng, dahilan sa kagustuhan mo na rin? Is that what you’re saying?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Hindi po, ako po’y sumusunod lamang sa utos, Your Honor.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. Ah, iyon ba ang pagtatanggol mo sa sarili mo, na sumusunod ka lang sa utos ng nakakataas sa iyo?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Opo.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. That is your view of your job, that whoever you think is higher than you, gives you an order, you must follow it and you do not bother to examine it for yourself? Is that what you want to say?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Ang nangyayari po, Your Honor, talaga pong wala na po akong ginawa.

SEN. DEFENSOR SANTIAGO. I see. Thank you.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Honorable Senator and Judge Cayetano.

SEN. CAYETANO. Ah, Mr. Lastimoso, with the permission of the Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed, Your Honor.

SEN. CAYETANO. Mr. Lastimoso, dito sa transcript ng cross examination ny’o ni Attorney Fortun, may lumalabas dito na tinanong ka kung kailan kayo nakipagkita sa Malacañang Guest House. At ang sagot mo ay, “On the latter part of 1998,” pero hindi mo masabi iyong buwan, ano. Pero hindi iyon ang katanungan ko sa iyo.

At pagkatapos, again sa pagtatanong sa iyo ni Attorney Fortun ay ang sagot mo dito sa Page 125, “The word, he said…” meaning, “he” si Pangulo, ano, was, and I quote: “Tulungan mo at mag coordinate kayong dalawa.”

Ang tanong ko sa iyo, Mr. Lastimoso, saan sinabi ni Pangulo itong “Tulungan mo at mag coordinate kayong dalawa” dito sa Guest House sa Malacañang. Saan doon sa Guest House?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Doon po sa harap ng kanyang desk, nandudoon po kami nag uusap.

SEN. CAYETANO. Sa harap ng desk?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Opo, doon po sa opisina niya sa Guest House.

SEN. CAYETANO. May opisina si Pangulo doon sa Guest House?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Opo.

SEN. CAYETANO. At nang sabihin ng Pangulo ito, sino ang kasama niya, ikaw lang?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Kami pong dalawa ni Governor Singson.

SEN. CAYETANO. Ah, ni Governor Singson?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Opo.

SEN. CAYETANO. At huling huling tanong. Ang sabi mo, ang iyong presumption di ba, ay “tulungan at mag coordinate kayong dalawa.” Iyon ang sabi mo, di ba, I assume, ‘no? Totoo ba iyon?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Iyon pong last sentence. Kasi sabi ko nga po, that was preceded by the statement na “Eto na si Governor Singson ang mamamahala sa jueteng sa Luzon. Mag usap kayong dalawa, mag coordinate kayo, tulungan mo siya at mag coordinate kayo.”

SEN. CAYETANO. Ah, kaya iyon ang presumption mo?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Opo.

SEN. CAYETANO. Na ang ibig mong sabihin, kaya ang tingin mo sa utos ng Pangulo ay “tulungan mo at mag coordinate kayong dalawa.” Tama ba iyon?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Iyon po ang pagkaintindi ko.

SEN. CAYETANO. Iyon ang pagkakaintindi mo?

MR. LASTIMOSO. Opo.

SEN. CAYETANO. Maraming salamat po.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Thank you. Nothing else from the parties? So, we will now excuse…

MR. FORTUN. Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What’s the pleasure of MR. Fortun?

MR. FORTUN. Mr. Chief Justice, only an administrative matter again. May I request that our Exhibit “7″ be remarked to reflect Exhibits “7 A” through “7 D” instead of “7 E”, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Secretary was able to get it?

The request is granted.

REP. APOSTOL. Mr. Chief Justice, may I request that our witness be excused?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The witness is excused if there are no further questions.

MR. LASTIMOSO. Marami pong salamat, Your Honor.

REP. APOSTOL. Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors, our next witness is Mr. Francisco Yap, the President of the Philippine Bank Clearing House Corporation. The one who will conduct the direct examination is Prosecutor- Congressman Oscar Moreno assisted by Congressman Arroyo.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Bring the witness to the witness box. Take the witness stand.

Administer the oath to the witness, Mr. Secretary of the Senate.

THE SECRETARY. Pakisabi lang ng “I do.”

You, Francisco Yap, do swear that the evidence which are given in the case now pending between the Philippines and Joseph Ejercito Estrada, President of the Philippines shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. So help you God.

MR. YAP. I do, sir.

REP. APOSTOL. Mr. Chief Justice may I request the help of the pages to distribute our exhibits to the Senators-Judges?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The pages are requested to distribute copies of the documents which should be covered by the testimony of the witness.

Prosecutor Moreno?

REP. MORENO. Thank you, very much, Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors.

Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors, offering the testimony of Mr. Francisco Yap in order to establish the fact that certain checks, six of them altogether, Mr. Chief Justice, amounting to a total amount of P200 million were negotiated and cleared through the Philippine Clearing House Corporation in which Mr. Yap is the President and Chief Executive Officer, as well as to establish the identity of these checks, Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors. With the permission of the Chief Justice and the Courts…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. We don’t have still the name and the personal circumstances of the witness.

REP. MORENO. Yes, thank you very much, Mr. Chief Justice.

Now, Mr. Witness, would you tell us your name as well as your personal circumstances.

MR. YAP. My name is Francisco Yap, Jr, married. I live at Encarnacion Street, BF homes, Quezon City, and we have six children and six little grandchildren. I work for the Philippine Clearing House as President of the company and I’ve been there for the last 20 years.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Excuse me, Mr. Chief Justice. Any number on Encarnacion Street?

MR. YAP. Number 7, sir.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Number 7.

REP. MORENO. Thank you, Mr. Witness. You said that you are working with the Philippine Clearing House Corporation and that you’ve been in that corporation for 20 years now. Could you tell us what the Philippine Clearing House Corporation essentially is?

MR. YAP. Well, essentially, Your Honor, what the Clearing House does is, all checks that are deposited in banks are sent for clearing and processing at the PCHC. Now, what that means is what we do essentially is, when we receive all of these checks, we sort them by drawee bank, we summarize them in the values and we make photo copies of them. In other words we do microfilm all checks that are sent to the Clearing House and we send them to the drawee banks the same day.

So, all checks that come to the Clearing House let’s say in the afternoon, after our processing all of them are sent and directed to the different drawee banks. Nothing is left with the PCHC.

REP. MORENO. Thank you. Is the Philippine Clearing House Corporation a government or a private corporation?

MR. YAP. The Philippine Clearing House is a private corporation. This is owned by the commercial banks in the Philippines.

MR. MORENO. And is that corporation accredited by the Bangko Sentral ng Pilipinas?

MR. YAP. Accredited you mean?

MR. MORENO. Or is that recognized by the Bangko Sentral ng Pilipinas?

MR. YAP. Yes. As a matter of fact, our offices, the computer processing area in fact, is housed inside the Bangko Sentral.

MR. MORENO. Now, Mr. Witness, let me describe how the Philippine Clearing House Corporation works essentially with respect to checks. Let’s say, for instance, that I am a depositor of Bank A. And I issue a check drawn on that bank payable to say, Mr. X. And Mr. X now, in possession of that check, can deposit it, that check with his bank which is Bank B. Could you tell the court how the negotiation, the clearing operates in regard to that example?

MR. YAP. Okay. What really happens is, when this check is deposited in that bank, that bank will put them together and do it in certain fashion that we require for them for the clearing of the checks, and they send this to us. When it comes to us, we now, as I said, process them, sort them and direct them to the drawee bank. Now, what happens is, at the drawee bank, they determine whether that check is funded or not. If it is not funded, then that check must be returned the next clearing day back to the Clearing House where we will then direct that check to the original presenting bank.

MR. MORENO. By drawee bank, you refer to Bank A in the example I have given?

MR. YAP. Yes, Your Honor.

MR. MORENO. And the Philippine Clearing House Corporation handles the clearing of checks of which banks and how many banks and what is the coverage area?

MR. YAP. All right. The members of the Clearing House is something like this. All commercial banks numbering something like over 50 are all members of the Clearing House and they send checks for clearing. But there are also thrift banks that participate in the clearing system and they number almost the same number. So, in total, there’s something like almost a hundred banks that send clearing checks to the PCHC.

MR. MORENO. And what about the coverage area, Mr. Witness?

MR. YAP. At the moment, we are covering something like 150 kilometer radius from Manila. So that areas for example, like Tarlac and so on, all the way to Cabanatuan to the north, and then all the way down to to, I believe Naga No, Naga is not included. But we

extend all the way back there as well. One hundred fifty kilometer radius, sir.

MR. MORENO. Now, Mr. Witness,

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes. With the permission of Prosecutor Moreno, what is

MR. MENDOZA. If I may interrupt?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What is the

MR. MENDOZA. May I call attention to the fact that there has been no offer of

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. A little louder, please.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Your mike is not on, Mr. Mendoza.

MR. MENDOZA. May I call attention to the fact that there has been no offer of this testimony and therefore, we are unable to appreciate the testimony being given, Your Honors.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. There was an offer of testimony in the beginning before the name and personal circumstances of the witness were taken upon request of Prosecutor Moreno.

MR. MENDOZA. Well, I apologize, I did not hear any offer.

MR. MORENO. Thank you very much.

Now, Mr. Witness

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed.

MR. MORENO. Thank you very much, Mr. Chief Justice.

Is PCI-Equitable Bank a member of that organization which clears its checks received or negotiated with the Philippine Clearing House Corporation?

MR. YAP. Yes, sir, they are.

MR. MORENO. And are all the branches of PCI Equitable Bank likewise included within that radius that you have mentioned?

MR. YAP. That’s correct, Your Honor.

MR. MORENO. Is PCI Equitable Bank, Branch Pacific Star also a member of that?

MR. YAP. Yes, Your Honor.

REP. MORENO. And can you tell me about interbranch checks?

Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors, I’d like to explain that there are maybe two or more branches of a bank. And let’s say, Branch 1, Branch 2, Branch 3 of Bank A. The deposit — the account maybe maintained with Branch 1.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Cannot you get that information from the witness because you are not a witness?

MR. YAP. Yes. I’m sorry, Mr. Chief Justice. I just wanted to address that to the witness.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

REP. MORENO. Let’s say, the check is drawn on Branch 1 and it is paid — the check is delivered to, again, another person. And that other person has an account with, say, Branch 2, same bank. If that check is deposited with Branch 2, in this case, PCI-Equitable Bank, would the clearing of that check still go through the clearing procedure of the Philippine Clearing House Corporation?

MR. YAP. Well, in the case of Equitable-PCI, all of their checks, whether it is interbranch, we call them, are checks that are drawn on another branch, they all send that to the Clearing House as well. And my understanding is, they do this to save on the operational part of it. Some banks may not necessarily send to clearing their own interbranch checks. They have their own mini-clearing, so to speak, operation. But in other banks, as in the case of Equitable-PCI, they do send even their interbranch checks to the Clearing House for processing. We do that, sir.

REP. MORENO. Thank you, Mr. Witness.

Now, Mr. Witness, you are here pursuant to a subpoena duces tecum and subpoena ad testificandum issued by the Honorable Court. And I am showing to you — Mr. Chief Justice, I’d like to manifest that copies of these documents have earlier been distributed to the Honorable Senators-Judges.

Now, Mr. Witness, I’m showing to you a letter dated December 11 from Mr. Francisco V. Yap, Jr., President of the Philippine Clearing House Corporation, addressed to the Honorable Chief Justice Hilario G. Davide, Jr., entitled: “Subpoena Ad Testificandum and Duces Tecum dated December 8, 2000.” This is marked as Exhibit “U,” Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. When was the marking done?

REP. MORENO. I’m sorry, Mr. Chief Justice?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. When was the marking done?

REP. MORENO. Just before the witness had taken the stand.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. In whose presence?

REP. MORENO. In the presence of the counsels of both panels.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. For a very orderly proceedings, as agreed upon during our conference this afternoon, it might be best that before the start of the testimony of a witness who will be testifying on the documents and there had been premarking of the documents that there should be an announcement of the premarkings. So, it will now be on record that these documents were premarked as such. Otherwise, right now there will be nothing on the record to show that there had been a premarking. So, can we enumerate all the documents which were premarked?

REP. MORENO. Yes.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. And so, henceforth, references thereto will be on the basis of the premarked numbers.

REP. MORENO. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

These premarked documents are Exhibits “U” and “U-I.”

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Name the documents.

REP. MORENO. This is the letter from Mr. Francisco V. Yap, Jr…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

REP. MORENO. …President of Philippine Clearing House Corporation, addressed to the Honorable Chief…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “U-I” is what? “U-I” is what?

REP. MORENO. “U-I” is the signature of Mr. Yap, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Okay. Go ahead.

REP. MORENO. Exhibit “V” is a one-page enumeration of certain figures, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Exhibit?

REP. MORENO. “V.”

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “V.” Is that the…

REP. MORENO. As in victory.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Is that the Annex “A”?

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Why don’t you proceed accordingly so it would be continuous instead of having a new letter? It is an annex of “U”?

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice. Annex “A” of the letter and the letter has various annexes, the last of which is Annex …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The premarking were done the pre- markings were done already by way of letters?

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So, in order to avoid any change thereon with an advice, however, that in the succeeding premarkings, annexes should be a part of the main exhibit. So this time you can go along with the marking.

REP. MORENO. Thank you.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So, Annex “A” is Exhibit “V”.

REP. MORENO. Exhibit “V”, and then …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Annex “V”, Annex “V” is …

REP. MORENO. I am sorry, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yeah.

REP. MORENO. And then in Annex “A”…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. In Annex “A”…

REP. MORENO. … the numbers, handwritten numbers 1, 2, 3, 4, 5

and 6, the columns across these numbers, Mr. Chief Justice…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

REP. MORENO. … these are marked as Annex “V 1″ Exhibit “V 1″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Exhibit “V 1″, okay.

REP. MORENO. And then the initial at the left bottom portion is marked as Exhibit “V 2″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. May we request the Honorable Senators-Judges to do the markings themselves on the copies provided them since ours do not have the premarkings.

REP. MORENO. I am sorry about that, Mr. Chief Justice. Mr. Yap came after lunch and we had wanted to mark premark the documents but the Court was …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Well, anyway, we only had the agreement this afternoon. Perhaps, on the succeeding days, we can have the pre markings done much earlier.

REP. MORENO. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

Annex “B”, Mr. Chief Justice, will be Exhibit “W”. And then the signature at the bottom right portion is Exhibit “W I”, “W 1″.

Exhibit … Annex “C 1″ of to the letter will be Exhibit “X”. And then the dorsal portion of the check will be Exhibit “X 1″. I am sorry, this is the face of the check, Mr. Chief Justice. The dorsal will be Exhibit “X 4″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Be “X 2″.

REP. MORENO. The dorsal portion…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What we have here for Annex “C 1″ is, the first on top is actually the front part of the check. The second appears to be the dorsal portion of a check.

REP. MORENO. These two faces, Mr. Chief Justice, are …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Different checks?

REP. MORENO. The same check, so they are marked as Exhibit “X 1″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The same check.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, the Honorable Senate President.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. May I be allowed to perhaps request counsel to identify the reproductions of the checks here. One, I think refers to the face of the check dated April 13, should be marked as Exhibit “1″ “X 1″. And then the dorsal side should be “X 2″. Don’t you think it will be more logical to do that?

REP. MORENO. Yes, thank you, Mr. Senate President. But the Secretary had marked it differently.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. All right.

REP. MORENO. The front and the dorsal portions of the check are bundled together and marked as Exhibit “X 1″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So, what had been the markings on Annex “C 1″?

THE SENATE LEGAL COUNSEL (MR. DAVID YAP). Your Honors please …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. There are two reproductions here.

THE SENATE LEGAL COUNSEL. Your Honors please, we only marked what was requested by the prosecutors/counsels, Your Honor. So we just followed what they told us to mark. So, when they told us to mark both sides of the check, the front and the dorsal portions as “X 1,” we marked it as such.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So as requested and thus pre marked?

THE SENATE LEGAL COUNSEL. Yes, Your Honor. That was the request of the prosecutor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So just dictate what had been pre marked.

THE SENATE LEGAL COUNSEL. Yes, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may now proceed, Honorable Moreno.

REP. MORENO. And then there may have been miscommunications, Mr. Chief Justice. Because in this page there is a marking of “X 2″ but this was what…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “X 2″?

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice, but this was intended for the dorsal portion of the check.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. What you can probably mark as “X 2″ would be the signature, the reproduction of a signature.

Yes, the Honorable Enrile.

SEN. ENRILE. Mr. Chief Justice, may I suggest that for orderly proceeding that the counsel who is examining the witness now perform the proper procedure of marking all of these documents and thereafter

manifest them into the record so that we can follow. Because right now we are confused. We do not know what is Exhibit “X” and what is Exhibit “X 1″ or Exhibit “X 2″ and so forth and so on.

REP. MORENO. Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

REP. MORENO. The comment of the Honorable Senator Judge is well taken. Actually we have attempted to pre mark but it was… Mr. Yap came in after lunch and the session was then ongoing, the hearing was ongoing. We had wanted to have this pre marked, but we have to wait for the break, Mr. Chief Justice, and this was only…

SEN. ENRILE. Mr. Chief Justice.

REP. MORENO. I’m sorry.

SEN. ENRILE. Mr. Chief Justice, I think we can save time if we will suspend the hearing for a few minutes so that the prosecutor who is presenting the witness can go out and mark these documents properly and then make a manifestation into the records so that we will have this as a matter of record and then we can also mark our copies of the documents accordingly.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, I think so, but I don’t think it… How much time do you need?

REP. MORENO. I think two minutes would be fine, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. I’ll make it five. No suspension of

session. We will just stay here.

Are you now ready, Honorable Moreno?

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

I’d like to thank the indulgence of the court.

Mr. Chief Justice, Annex “C 1″ of the letter will be marked as follows: the front portion of the check…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Meaning, the first…

REP. MORENO. The first. The first.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. …in Exhibit “C 1″.

REP. MORENO. Yes, it’s Exhibit “X”, Mr. Chief Justice. The dorsal portion, the second one, is Exhibit “X 1″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes.

REP. MORENO. And then, Mr. Chief Justice, the rubber stamp marking with a signature and the date on it it says:

“Philippine Clearing House Corporation

Manila, Philippines

This is to certify that this item is a photocopy of the original clearing document processed by PCHC.”

Date: December 11, 2000 with a signature, and below that signature are the words “AUTHORIZED SIGNATURE” that this be marked as Exhibit “X 2″, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Let the markings be done.

REP. MORENO. And Annex “C 2″ will be Exhibit the first portion, Mr. Chief Justice, will be Exhibit “Y.”

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, the Honorable Senate President.

REP. MORENO. The second is the…

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Excuse me, counsel, what is your Exhibit “X”?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “X” is the first, the first Annex C 1, this one.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Ah, the first.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Annex C 1, this is the first.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. All right.

REP. MORENO. The front of the check because this check…

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. So the back side is “X 1″ and would be “X 2.”

All right. Thank you, thank you, Mr. Counsel.

REP. MORENO. And that will essentially be the same up to Exhibit Annex “C 6”.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Honorable Senator Judge Enrile, with the permission of Prosecutor Moreno.

SEN. ENRILE. May I just inquire, Mr. Chief Justice, if the marking of this document Annex “C 1” will not be recorded as a marking of the entire document.

I think for orderly identification of this document, we ought to establish into the record that the prosecution is presenting Annex “C 1” to the letter of Pacifico V. Yap, Jr., President of the Philippine Clearing House Corporation, and that the face of the check, reproduction of the check appearing there is marked as Exhibit “X” and that the dorsal portion which is the back of the check is Exhibit”X 1”, so that we can we are talking of some document and when we refer to the entire document, we are actually talking of Annex “C 1” and we should do this in the case of all the other annexes.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The observation is well taken, there should really be an exhibit number for Annex “C 1” and then what are reproduced therein as to be submarked as part of Annex “C 1”.

May the Chair propose the following then for if there is no objection from the defense for easy identification.

Annex C 1 should be Exhibit “X,” the first reproduced document there as “X 1,” the second as “X 2,” then the certification of PCHC as “X 3.” Would you agree, defense? Then, let’s move on to Annex C 2, mark it as Exhibit “Y,” then the first as “Y 1,” the second “Y 2,” the certification of the Clearing House as “Y 3.”

REP. MORENO. And then…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. As we go along, Annex C.

REP. MORENO. As we go along.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Annex C should be “Z,” then the first is “Z 1,” the second is “Z 2,” the certification of the Clearing House as “Z 3,” Annex “C 4”, double “A”, Exhibit “AA.” Would you agree?

REP. MORENO. That’s how we have marked it already, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. But the original marking….

REP. MORENO. Yeah.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER…was the annex doesn’t have a number.

REP. MORENO. We agree, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So Annex C 4 would be Exhibit “AA,” the first figure will be the document first reflected will be Exhibit “AA 1,” the next will be “AA 2,” the PCHC certification as Exhibit “AA 3,” Annex C 5, mark the entire page Annex as “BB,” the first as “BB 1,” the second reproduction as “BB 2″ and the PCHC certification as Exhibit “BB 3.” Okay. You may now proceed.

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. No. There is another Exhibit C 6.”

So, Exhibit…rather Annex “C 6″ would be Exhibit “CC.” The first reproduction of a document as Exhibit “CC 1,” the second as Exhibit “CC 2,” and the PCHC certification as Exhibit “CC 3.”

You may now proceed.

REP. MORENO. Thank you.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Yes, Honorable Senate President.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. Congressman Moreno, do we understand that you have other exhibits marked already as “R”, “S”, “T”, and “U”, referring to other documents? Because you jumped from…

REP. MORENO. I understand, Mr. Senate President, that earlier documents had been premarked. Premarked also.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT. All right, thank you.

Thank you very much.

REP. MORENO. That may have contributed to the mix up.

Probably there could be a mechanism under which premarking can be done even while hearing is ongoing.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. We adopted the mechanism at the conference this afternoon. And I think we can work better during the succeeding days because of the agreement to premark much earlier.

REP. MORENO. Thank you very much, Mr. Chief Justice.

If I may please proceed, Mr. Chief Justice?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You can continue with the examination of the witness.

REP. MORENO. Mr. Witness, I’m showing to you Exhibit “U”, the letter dated December 11 from Francisco V. Yap, Jr., President of Philippine Clearing House Corporation, addressed to the Honorable Chief Justice Hilario G. Davide, Jr., what…is this…what relation, if any, does this letter have with your response to the subpoenas that were issued?

MR. YAP. Well, this is really the reply to the subpoena that was served on the PCHC to produce certain checks that were identified in that subpoena.

Now, as can be seen here in our letter, the first one is a master list that we say, and that, in fact, is now Exhibit “V.” That one is a computer printout where it can be seen that the six checks specified in the subpoena are, in fact, indicated there almost one after the other.

The first one is for P= 11 million, the next one is for another P= 11 million, the third one is for P= 7 million, the fifth one is forP= 3 million, followed by P77 million. And then the sixth check is for P= 91 million.

So, those are the checks that were identified in the subpoena. And this particular exhibit now shows that they, indeed, were listed and they passed through the Clearing House.

REP. MORENO. And from whom did these checks come from and to whom were these checks directed for negotiation?

MR. YAP. All right, in the next page over there, which is Exhibit…now Exhibit, is it “W”? “W,” we can see that the presenting bank branch, meaning the bank on whom these checks were deposited was Equitable-PCI Bank, Makati, Pacific Star Branch and the checks are so identified accordingly. The first one, which I earlier dictated, came from Equitable, Pedro Gil Branch; the next one was PCI Bank, Luneta Branch; the next one was Equitable Savings Bank; the next one to that was another PCI Bank in Quezon Avenue Branch; next to that is Equitable PCI in Diliman Branch, and then the last one is Scout Tobias in Timog Branch.

So, those were the Equitable Bank branches on whom those six checks were drawn on.

REP. MORENO. And in the same Exhibit “W,” there is a column that says, “Type of check.” Could you please read for the record what are these types of the checks?

MR. YAP. For the record, the first one was a cashier check, the next one is still a cashier’s it’s really a manager’s check, the next one is a cashier’s check again, and the next to that is a manager’s check followed by another cashier’s check, and the last one is a cashier’s check as well.

REP. MORENO. And what is the total as appearing in the bottom portion of Exhibit “W”?

MR. YAP. All of those checks total P200,000,000, Your Honor.

REP. MORENO. Now, Mr. Witness, what was the presenting bank of these six checks?

MR. YAP. Okay. The presenting bank was Equitable PCI, Makati, Pacific Star Branch.

REP. MORENO. Now, let me go back to Exhibit “V” towards the bottom of the page, there is an enclosed portion in which at the bottom of that portion says, “Equitable PCI, Makati, Pacific Star”, what relation does this what relation, if any, does this have with your statement earlier that the six checks were presented by Pacific Star Branch of PCI Equitable?

MR. YAP. In our computer processing, we prepare this master list, and as can be seen here, we group them by batch, and in each batch, the sending bank is identified.

Now, in this particular case, you would have all of those six checks amongst the many checks that were sent to clearing in that particular batch and we can see that from the total, all right, at the bottom there, as was indicated earlier, is Equitable PCI Pacific Star.

So, the sum of the batch in this particular group of checks that we processed would then be included in that particular total amount.

REP. MORENO. And the indicated total is P226,337,309.99, is that correct?

MR. YAP. That’s correct, Your Honor.

REP. MORENO. So, almost all or about five sixth of the total amount came from the 200,000,000 checks?

MR. YAP. That’s correct, sir.

REP. MORENO. Now, let me show you Exhibit “X 1″.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “X 1″.

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

SEN. DRILON. Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. May I call, Senator Drilon.

SEN. DRILON. Before we proceed to “X 1″, just on Exhibit “W”. Can the witness please tell us what “BRSTN” stands for? It’s indicated in Exhibit “W”.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “W”?

MR. YAP. Your Honor, BRSTN stands for “Bank Routing Symbol Transit Number”. This is really the number that we use to identify a branch, a bank branch. So, each bank branch that participate in the Clearing House do have a unique number that is assigned to them. Since the phrase is so long, we kind of, you know, use the initials so that we can very easily say that particular phrase, let’s say, BRSTN is really the number that we’re referring to that is assigned to each one of the branches that participate in clearing, sir.

REP. MORENO. And to further clarify the question raised by the Honorable Senator Judge Franklin Drilon, for instance, the first column, BRSTN, it says, “01013 068″, what does this mean?

MR. YAP. All right. The first two digits, 01, pertains to the area of the clearing region; 01, is Manila, Greater Manila; then you would have “013″, that is the number of the institution, meaning, Equitable Bank is assigned a number “013″; and then the last three digits is the identity of the branch of that particular institution.

So, you would then have the area number, the institution number and the branch number of that bank branch.

REP. MORENO. And then at same Exhibit “W”, the fifth column, on top of this column are the words “Check Number.” N-O, period. What do these numbers have in relation to the checks that were presented for clearing?

MR. YAP. Well, all checks would have check numbers on them and these are the identifying numbers on all of those checks, in effect.

REP. MORENO. Mr. Witness, Exhibit “X”…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. For a while…

REP. MORENO. I’m sorry.

SEN. ROCO. Again, just for clarity.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Senator Roco.

SEN. ROCO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice, with your permission.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed.

SEN. ROCO. On Exhibit “W”, when we say presenting bank branch that means it was Equitable PCI Bank, Makati, Pacific Star that was asking that it be deposited. All these 6 were deposited with Makati, Pacific Star, is this what we mean?

MR. YAP. That’s correct, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. So that the sources were the 6 branches, the different Equitable plus 5 Equitable and they were all given for deposit to Equitable, Makati.

MR. YAP. That’s correct, Your Honor.

SEN. ROCO. Yeah, thank you.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed, Honorable Moreno.

REP. MORENO. And that they were presented for clearing in the same banks.

MR. YAP. That’s correct, sir.

REP. MORENO. Now, in Exhibit “X 1″, what does this have what relation, if any, does this have with that in Exhibit “W”, the first item, in the amount of 11 million, what relation, if any, does Exhibit “X 1″ have in relation to that in Exhibit W?

MR. YAP. Okay. In our microfilms files, we then we’ll see this particular image of that check that we have listed in the previous document and we can see here that this is a cashier’s check for 11 million dated April 13, year 2000.

REP. MORENO. For purposes of simplification, Mr. Chief Justice, because there are 6 checks, could I ask the witness if Exhibits “X 1″, “Y 1″, “Z 1″, “AA 1″ and “BB 1″ and “CC 1″, if these are copies of the microfilm of the checks that are the front portion of the checks that are enumerated in Exhibit “W”?

MR. YAP. That’s correct, Your Honor.

REP. MORENO. And for purposes of simplification, the dorsal portion, Exhibit “X 2″, Exhibit “Y 2″, Exhibit “Z 2″, Exhibit “AA 2″, Exhibit “BB 2″ and Exhibit “CC 2″, these are all the dorsal portions of the checks that are enumerated in “Exhibit W”, is that correct?

MR. YAP. That’s correct, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Respectively.

REP. MORENO. Respectively.

MR. YAP. Respectively, yes.

REP. MORENO. And Exhibits “X 3″, “Y 3″, “Z 3″, “AA 3″, “BB 3″, “CC 3″, the wordings are the same in each of these portions, would you like to read these wordings, Mr. Witness?

MR. YAP. Yeah. All right, it says here: “That Philippine Clearing House Corporation, Manila, Philippines: This is to certify that this item is a photocopy of the original clearing document that was processed by PCHC.” And then you have the date over there and an authorized signature.

REP. MORENO. And whose signature is that in Exhibit “X 3″ up to Exhibit “Y 3″, Exhibit “Z 3″, “AA 3″, “BB 3″ and “CC 3″?

MR. YAP. Okay. This is the signature…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. For a while, Mr. Witness, the Honorable Senator Judge Enrile.

SEN. ENRILE. With the permission of the Chief Justice.

Mr. Chief Justice, I would like to inquire what is the materiality of these documents to this present proceeding?

REP. MORENO. Mr. Chief Justice, the materiality is that it establishes that these checks were presented by Pacific Star Branch of PCI-Equitable.

SEN. ENRILE. So what if these were presented by Pacific Star, what’s the connection of the Pacific Star with this proceeding?

REP. MORENO. As will be shown, Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honor, this 200 million will be shown as having been received by MR. Serapio from Mrs. Yolanda Ricaforte. And this 200 million were in the form of cashier’s checks, all payable to cash; and that these were all issued by six different banks – all branches of Equitable – except for one which is a branch of the savings bank of Equitable Bank.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. This is still for Article I?

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. You may proceed.

REP. MORENO. On Exhibit “X-1,” what is this portion across the – this check is payable to… Let me read – this is dated April 13, 2000 pay to the order of Cash in the amount of 11 million. What is this portion, Mr. Witness, at the upper left portion below the words “cashier’s check”?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Honorable Senator Drilon is recognized.

SEN. DRILON. I think, Mr. President, there was a pending question which was not answered and that is in reference to the…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Authorized signature.

SEN. DRILON. …authorized signature, “X-3,” “Y-3,” “Z-3,” etcetera. There was no answer to that question, Mr. President. May we ask the witness to answer that.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The witness may answer the question.

MR. YAP. All right. The signature appearing there is Arturo M. de Castro; he is our Vice President of PCHC in charge of the operations at the Clearing House.

REP. MORENO. Thank you. Could you tell us what Exhibit “X-1” … I read earlier that it’s payable to Cash, dated April 13, drawn by – as per Exhibit “W” – Equitable-PCI Bank, Pedro Gil, Robinson’s Branch.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. But what is the question?

MR. MORENO. At the bottom, below the words “cashier’s check” at the left upper portion, Mr. Witness, there is a marking, could you tell us what this marking is?

MR. YAP. The other part may not be readable but it does appear to me to be a “payee’s account only.”

REP. MORENO. And on Exhibit “Y-1,” again, at the upper left portion, there is a marking, could you tell us what that marking is?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Is it readable? Is it legible?

MR. YAP. It is not that readable, Your Honor, but normally what we would find there would be the crossing of the check where it denotes, if I am not mistaken, that that check must be deposited instead of encashed.

REP. MORENO. And Exhibit “Z-1,” again, at the upper left portion, there is a cross-marking. Could you tell us what it is?

MR. YAP. In the same way, it does look like it is another crossing of that check.

REP. MORENO. Again, Exhibit “AA”, there is – although it’s quite faint – at the left upper left portion…

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. “AA-1.”

REP. MORENO. “AA-1.” I’m sorry, Mr. Chief Justice, there is some crossing marks. Could you tell the court what these marks are?

MR. YAP. It does look like it is also a crossing of that check.

REP. MORENO. Again, Exhibit “BB-1,” the words — there are markings at the left upper portion of…

MR. YAP. This one, Your Honor, it’s readable; it looks like it is “for payee’s account only.”

REP. MORENO. And Exhibit “CC-1,” again, there is a marking in the upper left portion of … What does this marking mean?

MR. YAP. Again, it looks like it’s another crossing of that check.

REP. MORENO. All of these …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Honorable Senator Enrile.

SEN. ENRILE. Mr. Chief Justice, we’re using terms here that are intelligible. I would like to clarify, Mr. Chief Justice. When you say, “For Payee’s Account Only,” in this particular cashier’s check marked Exhibit “X 1,” the payee is Cash, isn’t it?

So, therefore, whoever is the holder of this check is the owner. The person who holds this check is really the owner of the check because it is pay to Cash. Like a paper bill in my pocket, whoever holds it is the owner, am I correct in this?

And so, therefore, still I raise the question of materiality of this. We are wasting our time on these checks. They have no there’s no established connection of these checks yet to the proceeding we have here.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Any comment …

REP. MORENO. Yeah, thank you very much, Mr. Chief

Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. … from MR. Moreno, Honorable Moreno.

REP. MORENO. A cash check is a bearer instrument and under the Negotiable Instruments Law, bearer instruments can only be negotiated by mere delivery. However, banking practice will never the words, “For Payee’s Account Only” or whenever there’s these checks are crossed, the practice is that these checks have to be deposited even if, under the law, they are bearer instruments and can be negotiated only by mere delivery.

Now, Mr. Chief Justice, the materiality again of this document has to do with the 200 million that was received by MR. Serapio from Mrs. Ricaforte, which is the residual balance of the jueteng money, Mr. Chief Justice, related to Article I.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The observation and manifestations are noted, but that should not be taken as evidence yet.

The Honorable Majority Leader.

THE MAJORITY LEADER. Mr. Chief Justice, with unanimous consent, I move to suspend this impeachment trial until 2 o’clock in the afternoon of tomorrow, Tuesday, 12th

of December 2000.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. It is already 7:10 in the evening. Any objection to the motion for suspension?

REP. APOSTOL. Mr. Chief Justice, before we adjourn …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Honorable Apostol.

REP. APOSTOL. We have requested for subpoena and subpoena duces tecum to the two witnesses, they are now here.

In the meantime, may I request that only one should come back tomorrow; the other one need not come back. We’re requesting …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Why don’t we just require the two to come back because you may be able to finish with the first?

REP. APOSTOL. May I reform my request that the subpoena and the subpoena duces tecum has been issued by this Honorable Body to Madam Annie Ngo, actually representing President Wilfredo Vergara and Mrs. Beatriz Bagsit. May I request that the subpoena I mean, they should be instructed to come back tomorrow so that they will not be …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Are they here? Are they here now?

REP. APOSTOL. Yes, they are now here at the ano. So …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. They are at the holding room?

REP. APOSTOL. So, may I then …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Secretary of the Senate …

REP. APOSTOL. Mr. Chief Justice, may I then …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. … is directed to inform these witnesses and to advise them that they should come back tomorrow.

REP. APOSTOL. Mr. Chief Justice, may I request that the Honorable Oscar Moreno be allowed to say something on this?

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The Honorable Oscar Moreno is recognized.

REP. MORENO. Thank you very much, Mr. Chief Justice. Actually, subpoenas had already been issued to Mr. Vergara, the president of PCI Equitable, and Mrs. Bagsit, an officer of the PCI Equitable Makati head. And documents had earlier been shown to us, Mr. Chief Justice. However, a cursory look at these documents would show, Mr. Chief Justice, that there may still be a need for more documents pertaining to particularly the activities at the Pacific Star Branch on April 25, and the activities likewise of the Strata Branch of PCI Equitable Bank between April 25 and November of year 2000. And in this regard, Mr. Chief Justice, Your Honors, I’d like to manifest that the manager of Strata Branch of PCI Equitable Bank has recently left for abroad. This was the information that was relayed to us by Mrs. Bagsit, and that she will be away for three months together with the husband, Mr. Chief Justice.

And with respect to the Pacific Star Branch, the manager, as of April of year 2000, Miss Cristy Cruz has now been reassigned to the 8th Avenue Branch of the same bank. And her chores are now being handled by her assistant then who is Maricar Perez, Assistant Manager.

Now, Mr. Chief Justice, I think it is very significant for the prosecution to have a closer look at the records of the Pacific Star Branch and the Strata Branch of the PCI Equitable Bank, particularly we would like to look at the transaction journal in respect of the accounts as well as the computer records of the branch and of the entire bank, Mr. Chief Justice. I know this may be a bit difficult to do, Mr. Chief Justice, but what we have seen are photocopies of what seem to be a bearer savings account. And Mr. Chief Justice, I have worked in banks for more than 20 years and my personal taking is that …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So why don’t you just make the appropriate application for the purpose?

REP. MORENO. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice. That is why I wanted to request my senior co prosecutor that we may first have to make depositions, Mr. Chief Justice, with respect to …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Then make the proper application.

REP. MORENO. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

REP. APOSTOL. In that case, Your Honor, may we request that in the meantime they should not be requested to come back tomorrow.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Who will not be requested to come back tomorrow?

REP. APOSTOL. Mrs. Annie Ngo and Mrs. Beatrice Bagsit because they are here.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So who will be the witnesses tomorrow?

REP. APOSTOL. We have, we have.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Would you have enough tomorrow?

REP. APOSTOL. More than enough.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So in the meantime, the subpoenas issued to them should be considered withdrawn and you will revive it later?

REP. APOSTOL. Yes. Because we intend either to take their deposition. We’ll file the necessary action or we will …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So in the meantime these witnesses shall be excused until further application for their reappearance?

REP. APOSTOL. Yes, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. So, the trial …

MS. VERSOLA. Your Honor, we are a little bit confused …

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Attorney VERSOLA.

MS. VERSOLA. … as to the identity of the witnesses they will present tomorrow. May we know the names?

REP. APOSTOL. We have submitted the list.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. I understand that the last time that we had a hearing the names were mentioned for Article I.

MS. VERSOLA. For tomorrow, Your Honor, we were expecting Mrs. Bagsit. But since they have withdrawn her, may we request as to the identity of the witness they will present tomorrow?

REP. APOSTOL. The others who were mentioned in the list which we submitted.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The others mentioned in the list.

MS. VERSOLA. What are their names?

REP. APOSTOL. They are there we submitted.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. It was mentioned the other day. I mean last Friday.

MS. VERSOLA. There are several, Your Honor. We would like to have the particular identity of their present witnesses that will be presented.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Are you ready to disclose the names of the witnesses to be presented tomorrow?

REP. APOSTOL. No, Your Honor. We have a very bad experience on this.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. Well, anyway, we already had an agreement in the matter of the presentation of witnesses. If their names are not disclosed, then the cross examination may be deferred.

MS. VERSOLA. Yes, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. But if their names are announced earlier, cross examination shall immediately follow after the completion of the direct testimony.

MS. VERSOLA. Thank you, Your Honor.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. I think the agreement is still effective and it will be enforced strictly.

REP. APOSTOL. Thank you, Mr. Chief Justice.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER. The trial is suspended until two o’clock tomorrow.

THE TRIAL WAS SUSPENDED AT 7:18 P.M.